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Aumont

The baseball amateur draft is a time many people look forward to so that they can voice their opinions about players that most people have never heard of. Some people do it well, some people don't, and some people take the stuff that qualified people say and try to pass it off as their own scouting insight. It's a delightful circus of emotion, hope, and plagiarism that always seems to get a big reaction from fanbases that've never even seen their new top draft pick play in a game.

Star-divide

We went over this a year ago, but again, I'm gonna be honest - I don't know much about the guys getting drafted. Because my weeks leading up to the draft are spent working, watching the M's, and watching the NHL playoffs, I just don't have time to appropriately research the countless players that might end up as the next top Mariner prospects. It's both something I wish I could do and something I know I can't.

Fortunately, other people can. And these other people are giving me really good vibes about our new 6'7, 18 year old right-handed prospect from the north(east), Phillippe Aumont. Baseball America likes him. John Sickels likes him. Dave Cameron likes him. And so on and so forth. For a little background, here's an interview with him recently posted at Baseball Analysts. He's only been pitching for four years and he didn't have a high school team in Canada, so you better believe he's incredibly raw, but when you're so raw and yet still so good, that just means you've got a high ceiling. The only downside I can see to this right now is that Aumont's been living in Gatineau, Quebec, which is situated right next to Ottawa, and as many of you are no doubt currently aware, Ottawa has been the cause of much personal heartbreak over the past ten years.

I'm not going to parrot what other people are saying; it's their work, and I don't have the right to claim it's mine. Dave's write-up is pretty thorough, encouraging, and free, so that should be the first thing you read. The bare bones are that Aumont has a four-seam fastball that's touched the high-90s, a two-seam fastball around 91-93 that he uses as his primary pitch, and developing secondary stuff, including a slider with pretty good potential. MiLB has a player profile complete with video for those interested.

The only new thing I want to contribute to the discussion is this - check out Aumont's delivery when compared to Brandon Morrow's:

Morrow is all power, coming off the rubber full force towards home plate. Aumont, meanwhile, is one of those "tall-and-fall" guys who starts moving towards the plate almost immediately, with his arm catching up later on. The result is that he's getting little momentum from his body and most of it from an arm that whips through the zone a lot like a right-handed Randy Johnson's.

Good? Bad? Meaningless? I'm not smart enough to answer that. Based on personal experience, my gut feeling is that he could generate more velocity by staying back a little longer, but I wouldn't be surprised if Aumont's groundball tendencies were the direct result of his delivery - his body is pulling him down towards the plate, so his arm follows suit. And since Aumont's effective two-seamer and ability to make hitters pound the ball into the ground are his big drawing points, it'd be silly to suggest that he change the way he throws. Consider this more an observation than highlighting a potential problem.

Aumont is young, raw, inexperienced, and a whole bunch of other synonyms. Even in the best-case scenario, it's going to be a while before he's ready to help the Mariners at the Major League level. However, the upside is huge, and in recognizing that the men in charge were able to ignore their presumed biases towards players who could contribute in a matter of months, instead of years. For the first time in what seems like forever, the Mariner organization has made a decision in its long-term best interests, rather than blowing off the future in the pursuit of immediate gain. And for the first time since last night, I'm smiling.

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Comments

Also, as was pointed out below
once he's signed, expect Aumont to take the Tillman/Butler route of starting in Arizona and ending the season in Everett.
I have a thing for players
who give enigmatic interviews, so I'm a big fan already.
Interesting item
Not that anyone here can answer, but someone at USSM mentioned that Dave mentioned that he has heard that Butler is pitching hurt and that's why he's struggling so bad.

Interesting, and it would explain his control problems.  I hope someone comes to their senses, pulls him from the rotation and allows him to heal sooner rather than later, as further use could lead to further damage.  Because, as it stands, walking a bunch of guys and getting pounded with a bum arm doesn't do anyone any good.

Saw that...
I think Butler's big velocity jump coming into the draft last year may be the culprit, as his arm may not have been able to cope with it as well as one would hope.  It happens sometimes, but I'd still either pull him from the rotation or keep close tabs on him, working on mechanical basics and seeing if they can get that together if they can't get him in games quite as often.
Isn't that what happened with Morrow in college?
I don't know how Cal handled it, but he seems fine now.  I know Morrow has pretty lousy control, but his velocity is still good.
'zactly
That's where I got the idea of how to deal with it...
If they bullpen him
Then they'll have plenty of opportunities to get him in the game, if you know what I mean :(  Much of the staff's struggling.
Very well said.
Covering the NFL, I think your opening paragraph and especially this quote:

"It's a delightful circus of emotion, hope, and plagiarism that always seems to get a big reaction from fanbases that've never even seen their new top draft pick play in a game."

Is doubly meaningful for the NFL draft. It's amazing how much regurgitated scout-speak gets thrown around leading up to and following the draft, or how much credence many fans give this thrice removed mumbo-jumbo.

pitching form...
in all reality, pitching form isn't related to velocity unless mechanical fundamentals are abandoned (with some rare exceptions).  So a tall and fall approach won't warrant a slower velocity than staying back for longer in the windup.

the key is timing.  looking at aumont's initial form shows an impressive learning curve.  some people find their mechanics naturally...others have to force them.  a lot of people put too much reliance on pushing off with the legs for velocity.  in reality it's all about when your hips square-off to the plate followed by the upper torso.  think of it like winding a rubber-band around a pencil and letting go.  the arm-whip created is where the velocity is combined with arm-strength.

this is why you see short pitchers throwing just as fast as tall pitchers...timing.  it always comes back to fundamentals.

the one place where tall pitchers have the advantage is the release point.  every foot closer to the plate where the ball is released creates an artificial 3 mph increase in velocity because it reduces the amount of time the batter has to react to a pitch.  This is why a lot of pitching coaches preach the tall and fall to tall guys and not so much to short pitchers.

That said, Aumont has a lot of upside considering height and his devastating 3/4 delivery.  With the proper training and conditioning he could easily be a top of the rotation guy.

br

Velocity is a function of joint torque
Not so much
Jeff Weaver torques his joints whenever he smokes out and it hasn't gotten his fastball past 89.
joint torque...
being the label of what i just said in not so many words.

looking at his scouting video one more time brought a couple more things to mind:

  1.  He doesn't finish all that well.  With a tall and fall approach you should see more of a follow-through than with other forms.  if you watch his vid that's linked from dave cameron's blog you'll see his arm bounce back.  A consistent and complete follow through will lead to him leaving the ball down and decrease stress to the arm.
  2.  It appears (from that limited video coverage at least) that he crosses up the catcher a lot.  Either the catcher isn't all that great or he has a repetition issue.  Not really a big deal because when he gets under big league trainers they'll pound it into him over and over and over.  I like that he's a raw talent and hasn't receive much pitching instruction.  Hopefully he'll have an open mind and work on the form a tad.
br
I noticed that, too.
The guy seems really conscious of finishing in "good fielding position," which isn't entirely appropriate for the rest of his delivery.

It's pretty easy to see what coaching he's had, and what coaching he hasn't.

Oh, I was just speaking from my own background.
I used to pitch like Aumont, but I gained a few miles when I started staying back. It could've very easily been a coincidence, but I don't have enough knowledge on the subject to say any more than that.

I do love that he's a tall sinkerballer. For a high schooler, his skillset makes him a pretty safe pick, and with an awful lot of upside.

Yeah..
tall and fall is preached at a young age because it's the easiest thing to teach younger pitchers.  Staying back takes a huge amount of balance but gives your more time to set up the mechanics at your own pace.

Personally, i'd only push a tall and fall approach for tall athletes with a natural timing.

Otherwise, sometimes it's better to let one's form come naturally.  See: Ichiro's batting form.

br

Jeff - I think this is a job for you.
Aumont lives in Gatineau now (with a couple who took him in after he shook his drug habit that had him living on the streets), but his English isn't good enough for him to actually be from Gatineau.

However, we know that his father is a big fan of the Montreal Canadiens, and Philippe himself is actually a New Jersey Devils fan because he loves Martin Brodeur.  Brodeur is also from Montreal.

So I'm guessing Aumont is actually from somewhere further east than Gatineau, but with all the hockey connections I figure you're the best guy to pin that down.

I'm just guessing a Montreal suburb.
Martin Brodeur and Roberto Luongo
are from the same Montreal suburb.  If Aumont comes from there, too, soon the neighbourhood will be flooded with scouts from all sports.
Where did you get the info on a drug habit?
Or am I missing some sarcasm here?
Baseball America says he has a past he doesn't
like to talk about much.
Given what those details hint at
I can't blame him.

Here's to a new beginning.

Ottawa Sun article.
http://www.ottawasun.com/Sports/Baseball/2007/06/02/4227917-sun.html
Thanks!
That's not as bad as it sounded to me originally. Doesn't sound like he was a crack addict or anything. Just had a rough time growing up.

Hopefully that means he appreciates this opportunity he's been given!

I'm not concerned.
This guy's maturity is light years ahead of Tillman's.
Sure sounds like it according to his
"foster" parents. It really doesn't sound like he did much of anything I didn't dabble in when I was younger.

The kids going to be a pitcher, not the President of the United States (or Canada's Prime Minister...   That's what they have, correct?)

Man... kid's probably got quite a story
Rick Rizzs and FSN are gonna have field days talking about his life story once he makes it.
I suppose that is a downside.
Sure, it's a new story for Rizzs to tell, but he'll tell it every 5 days for 6 years.
And everytime the camera shows him in the dugout
And everytime there's a blowout and he's fishing for topics.  And....
OT
check out Schill's line
Guess how much I like Schill?
NOHITTER NOHITTER NOHITTER NOHITTER NOHITTER NOHITTER NOHITTER NOHITTER NOHITTER NOHITTER NOHITTER NOHITTER NOHITTER NOHITTER NOHITTER NOHITTER NOHITTER NOHITTER NOHITTER NOHITTER NOHITTER NOHITTER NOHITTER NOHITTER NOHITTER NOHITTER NOHITTER NOHITTER NOHITTER NOHITTER NOHITTER NOHITTER NOHITTER NOHITTER NOHITTER DON'T BLOW IT DON'T CHOKE DON'T BLOW IT DON'T CHOKE DON'T BLOW IT DON'T CHOKE DON'T BLOW IT DON'T CHOKE DON'T BLOW IT DON'T CHOKE DON'T BLOW IT DON'T CHOKE DON'T BLOW IT DON'T CHOKE DON'T BLOW IT DON'T CHOKE DON'T BLOW IT DON'T CHOKE DON'T BLOW IT DON'T CHOKE DON'T BLOW IT DON'T CHOKE DON'T BLOW IT DON'T CHOKE DON'T BLOW IT DON'T CHOKE DON'T BLOW IT DON'T CHOKE DON'T BLOW IT DON'T CHOKE DON'T BLOW IT DON'T CHOKE DON'T BLOW IT DON'T CHOKE DON'T BLOW IT DON'T CHOKE DON'T BLOW IT DON'T CHOKE DON'T BLOW IT DON'T CHOKE DON'T BLOW IT DON'T CHOKE DON'T BLOW IT DON'T CHOKE DON'T BLOW IT DON'T CHOKE DON'T BLOW IT DON'T CHOKE DON'T BLOW IT DON'T CHOKE DON'T BLOW IT DON'T CHOKE DON'T BLOW IT DON'T CHOKE DON'T BLOW IT DON'T CHOKE DON'T BLOW IT DON'T CHOKE DON'T BLOW IT DON'T CHOKE DON'T BLOW IT DON'T CHOKE DON'T BLOW IT DON'T CHOKE DON'T BLOW IT DON'T CHOKE
so its not a perfect game
if a runner reaches base on an error?
A perfect game is nobody reaching base.At all.
Correct.
Don't expect Schilling to buy Lugo any drinks for a while.
Wow Kendall is slow.
FUUUUUUUUUUUCK
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO.  Plz break it up, Shannon, kthx.
YEEEEEEEESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS
I LOVE YOU, SHANNON STEWART.
Could we keep this thread on topic?
Go nuts in the draft thread.
Sorry... I'm done with that mess
So, did Schill accidentally run over your dog?
Actually, replace "accidentally" with "repeatedly," and replace "dog" with "son."
Without the error
it's a perfect game.
Mangini
http://www.minorleaguebaseball.com/milb/events/draft_report/y2007/tracker.jsp?mc=mangini

Looks like a solid prospect. Could be a sleeper.

I love how
the only listed weakness is something conditional:

At this game, there was some concern that Mangini had developed some bad habits in terms of having an aluminum bat swing. He handled wood well last summer and scouts will want to see him return to that swing before considering him early.

In other words, once he gets used to wood bats, then....

Looks like two nice picks so far with Aumont and Mangini.

If it's just a bad habit from switching
back and forth, I'll be optimistic and go with his performance (batting title) in the Cape Cod league, using wooden bats!
I'm still confused
how you do worst wit Al bats.
Timing maybe?
I haven't swung many wooden bats, but it seemed like you would have to start your swing earlier with wood (heavier, less end-loading).
Overswinging
That would be my guess.  
Substance consistency
With wood, you need to hit the ball with the right part of the bat for maximum effect, and to prevent it from breaking.

With aluminum, you hit the ball square with any part of the bat and the ball will come off the bat with the same general velocity.

So how would that explain him being worse
with aluminum, and better with wood?
could be a comfort thing
he may just be more comfortable with a wooden bat.
Oh no, not worse
but more like his swing will not translate to wooden bats, where he needs to swing the bat with more accuracy.
This is what's confusing me:
"At this game, there was some concern that Mangini had developed some bad habits in terms of having an aluminum bat swing. He handled wood well last summer and scouts will want to see him return to that swing before considering him early."

It's from BA I beleive.

What it appears to mean
Is that he's just trying to make any contact, since the ball will rocket off of any part of an aluminum bat... whereas you need to focus on making contact with the sweet spot of a wooden bat, because it will die off the handles, among other things, and, of course, break the bat if the ball hits certain parts.
Hopefully it's just a bad habit he developed
recently, since he did fine in Cape Cod with wooden bats.
Yeah, I'm sure it's easily correctible
I don't know
It seems like its kinda some scout bullshit.
Are there signability issues?
He didn't sound thrilled by the prospect of playing for Seattle.
None at all.
He just isn't really able to convey his feelings real well in a second language. He'll be signed in no time.
He has zeero interest in going to college
is what I have read. Seems like an easy one to sign to me.
Yeah.
Besides, there's no way the Mariners waste a high pick on a guy they can't sign. Not again.
Last one was Mayberry, correct?
whose no-sign landed us Adam Jones
Not directly, but yes.
Mayberry is right
and I'm glad we did not get him

.316  .492  .808

That would suck to have him in the minors,
wouldn't it?  
an 803 OPS
from a guy who's 24, and striking out once per game in high A ball is not note-worthy.
Aumont should be really easy sign.
I assume you're asking about Aumont.
Language barrier
It's like when I'm in Spanish class and I have to talk in Spanish, a language I don't know well (yes, despite my name; half my family's Filipino).  I don't sound very enthusiatic either, but it's not because I hate what I'm talking about.
Mabuhay!
Jeff, I think this is a sign...
A day after your beloved Senators were knocked off by the formerly mighty Ducks, the Mariners draft a player from the region.

This could very well be Canadian karma.  After the gut wrenching loss in the Finals karma decided to throw you a bone (or at least that's what I'm hoping).  Considering the sheer amount of suffering and copious amounts of alcohol ingested of said hockey team, karma owes you a great deal.  Hopefully my theory is correct.  Because if you balance out the heaps of bad karma with this kid, then he's destined to be ace #2 behind Felix.  One can only hope your suffering has not been for nothing.

Thanks for taking one for the team.

I'm glad I had a choice.
>:(

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