Straight from the best sportswriter in the city:
In search of a replacement for Bill Bavasi, who was fired on June 16, the Mariners will interview Peter Woodfork, the Arizona Diamondbacks assistant general manager; Jerry DiPoto, Diamondbacks director of player personnel; Tony Bernazard, New York Mets vice president of player development; Kim Ng, Los Angeles Dodgers assistant general manager; and Tony LaCava, Toronto Blue Jays assistant general manager.
...
The Mariners are expected to talk to more candidates next week as they aim for an announcement shortly after the World Series.
When you're dealing with people who don't have any prior GM'ing experience, it's impossible to say what they'd be like once granted total control of a roster, but based on a little quick Googling, none of these executives rode the nepotism escalator too close to the sun, so that's a step up from our last guy. There's pretty much no possible way we come out of this looking worse. It's just up to the suits in charge to maximize the degree to which we get better.
Of these five, I think I'm most fond of Woodfork (Harvard! Epstein!) and least fond of Bernazard (Controversy! Subterfuge!), but honestly, I can't say for sure, because we just don't know enough about these people to draw conclusions. It's a mystery, and as easy as it would be to simply judge the candidates based on the organizations for whom they've worked in the past, that's a dangerous and highly misleading approach, because a single organization will employ people with a million different philosophies. Mat Olkin and Bill Bavasi worked for the same team, remember. The same goes for Paul DePodesta and Randy Smith. Hiring someone who worked for the Red Sox isn't guaranteed to work out better than hiring someone who worked for the Orioles, because every front office is a mixed bag. We just have to hope that Armstrong and Lincoln know what they're doing, which, uhhhhh
We'll see which other names come up next week. Barring some nightmare, I think I'll be happy just as long as we avoid hiring some leathery retread. In this case, I'd say better the devil we don't know than the devil we do. If this organization is to persist as a failure, here's to failing differently.
0 recs | 185 comments
Fuck Harvard.
I would like this to be over already with a good resolution.
Matthew - October 8, 2008
I haven't really heard the names of too many bad resolutions
Ng, Woodfork, LaCava, whoever – they all seem like improvements, and while the degree of the improvement would differ with each candidate, what’s important is that it’s progress.
Jeff Sullivan - October 8, 2008
Pretty much. That's why I want it over with already so we can move on.
Matthew - October 8, 2008
No Cam Bonifay!
JI - October 8, 2008
Great, get ready for Dave Littlefield.
eponymous_coward - October 8, 2008
Oh, that was a joke.
I’m actually pretty happy about the candidate list. Woo failing differently.
eponymous_coward - October 8, 2008
Can we assume these are their five top choices?
If so, that looks pretty promising. At least compared with what the pessimistic side of me was expecting.
I guess there might be a candidate currently working for one of the four organizations that are still playing.
Teej - October 8, 2008
After reading Stone's piece again, I guess that would be a bad assumption, since they have more planned next week.
Teej - October 8, 2008
They moved the timeline back from the last time I checked
They had originally hoped to announce right before the WS
Robert - October 8, 2008
Maybe the Dodgers' advancement has something to do with that.
JI - October 8, 2008
That's my bet
I am just about willing to place any amount of money on Ng getting the job
Robert - October 8, 2008
I could live with that.
JI - October 8, 2008
Taken with a grain of salt but Churchill says the whispers say she isnt anywhere close to being ready
Robert - October 8, 2008
This is similar to when Erik Bedard was faking an injury at the advice of his agent.
JI - October 8, 2008
Throw enough Spaghetti against the wall...
Robert - October 8, 2008
and you have the internet.
pdb - October 8, 2008
Mmm, tasty internet.
kentroyals5 - October 8, 2008
I am shocked, terribly shocked that would be said about a woman.
I mean, really, the ultimate old boys club intimating a woman who’d been working in MLB for that long not being ready? Next we’ll be hearing about how blacks may not have some of the necessities to be, let’s say, a field manager, or, perhaps, a general manager from some Dodgers executive or something.
Say, come to think of it, can’t we hire another one of Buzzy Bavasi’s kids?
eponymous_coward - October 8, 2008
I am not the least bit surprised that its being said
We don’t live in a perfect world
Robert - October 8, 2008
And maybe she isn't ready?
Matthew - October 8, 2008
Only men aren't ready
Robert - October 8, 2008
^white
Matthew - October 8, 2008
As opposed to the retreads that are?
Look, if you’re not “ready” for a promotion after 10+ years of working in your chosen field, you’re basically saying the person is Bill Bavasi, and it’s not a matter of being “ready”, any more than Willie Bloomquist isn’t “ready” to hit 50 home runs in a season- it’s a matter of “can’t do the job and they’ve hit their ceiling”. (Bill’s problem was people seem quite willing to let him prove the Peter Principle’s applicability to MLB.)
Given that MLB executives have given any number of bad GMs multiple bites at the apple, I’m really skeptical that we should judge who’s “ready” and who isn’t based on whispered scuttlebutt- especially since baseball has a history of being old-boys-networked, insular, and resistant to change.
eponymous_coward - October 8, 2008
It doesn't matter if you are the smartest kid in the room if nobody wants to work with you on a group project
Robert - October 8, 2008
I'm pretty sure there'd be Negro Leagues if people always took that attitude.
Sometimes, you need to tell the baseball old boys network to perform the anatomically impossible when it comes to their ways of thinking. Thank God Billy Beane’s always been wiling to do that as necessary.
eponymous_coward - October 8, 2008
And this team isn't seriously looking a retreads
In fact Kim Ng has been around Baseball for the longest of all these names.
Robert - October 8, 2008
Or maybe she's not actually ready.
Matthew - October 8, 2008
Out of curiosity what reasons do we have to believe that she's ready to be a solid GM?
Jeff Sullivan - October 8, 2008
USSM liked her 5 years ago
Robert - October 8, 2008
A lot of people like her
I’m trying to remember why.
I can’t imagine that “Ng will likely be the first woman GM in baseball history and here’s why she won’t be good at it” would be a very popular opinion, but has anyone ever tried it?
Jeff Sullivan - October 8, 2008
Ng and LaCava are my favorite picks of the bunch.
Here’s a Baseball Prospectus interview conducted almost 5 years ago. Her top strengths include agents, players, and other club executives. Unless her opinions have changed in the last few years her ideal team to build would be more like how the Yankees are built. BUT she’s definitely aware that it’s going to differ from club to club. She’s aware of ballpark factors. She would put emphasis on scouting an player evaluation and acquire a manager who’s good with young players and is a great strategist.
It’s tough to say whether she’s on top of the latest statistical tools. She believed that stats don’t tell everything but she’s also an analytical person.
I think she would be a surprisingly good fit here.
ThundaPC - October 8, 2008
All of that is about Kim Ng btw, even though I mentioned LaCava.
ThundaPC - October 8, 2008
I think the repeated use of "her" and "she" made that pretty clear.
pdb - October 8, 2008
I had forgotten about that interview.
Thanks for the link reminder.
Bad news, Yuni.
Jeff Sullivan - October 8, 2008
What does she mean by "Yankees?"
Post 2000’s roster construction like Silva, Wright, Pavano signings; or the build-from-within Jeter, Williams core? This is important. I’m assuming it’s the latter because I can’t imagine her being stupid after what I’ve read about her.
Double06 - October 8, 2008
It's the latter, because that was the strategy when she was there.
Aaron Campeau - October 8, 2008
Wasn't there a KJR interview where she said impressive things?
JI - October 8, 2008
Haven't listened to it yet
Here
Robert - October 8, 2008
They focus way to much on her sex in this interview so its not really worth the time
Robert - October 8, 2008
oh and fuck her for joking about the yankees making the david justice trade
Robert - October 8, 2008
The next David Justice could be ours instead of theirs.
JI - October 8, 2008
Realistically?
If you’re using ME as a touchstone to judge the caliber of MLB front office employees, you should be fired. So I won’t presume to judge her qualifications per se outside of what I’ve heard in the press making her a plausible candidate.
My observation is simply that “ready” has a high likelihood of being a cop-out that covers other reasons (ala “resigned to spend time with family” and other corporate-speak), plus considering who the average MLB senior executive thinks is “ready” for the job, it’s not altogether certain THEY know what they are doing that well, either.
eponymous_coward - October 9, 2008
Does the Ready Fairy just show up one day and sprinkle Magic Ready Dust, then?
Seriously, she’s been an assistant GM for 10 years. Do you seriously think you can do a job for ten years, and not be “ready” for a promotion, and that actually stand for anything other than a code word for “she’s maxed out her usefulness to a MLB front office, and does not have what it takes to be deserve a promotion”?
Or, to put it another way- Kim Ng has been an AGM for as long as Billy Beane’s been a GM. 10 years before Billy Beane was a GM, he was playing baseball for the Minnesota Twins, let alone actually being in a front office.
Basically, if she isn’t “ready” after 10 years, it’s hard to see what makes her “ready”.
eponymous_coward - October 9, 2008
The poor Chinese are always discriminated against in basesball
Dewey N - October 8, 2008
I'm pretty sure Ng is a Korean name.
joof - October 8, 2008
Nope.
Teej - October 9, 2008
Pronounced as Ing I think it is
Pronounced as Ang I think is Chinese
Corco - October 9, 2008
No.
Matthew - October 9, 2008
I think we should defer to Robert's wisdom.
JI - October 9, 2008
Um...
We should defer to HER wisdom. She says she’s Chinese America. So she is.
rtang - October 9, 2008
Woosh
JI - October 9, 2008
Explain the Korean I know pronounced Ing but spelled Ng
Corco - October 9, 2008
Oh my god, a last name isn't exclusive to one country?!?!?!?!
THIS CHANGES EVERYTHING EVER KNOWN IN HISTORY!
Matthew - October 9, 2008
Good point
Corco - October 9, 2008
It's always supposed to be pronounced "ing" like in sing.
It can be romanized as anything however.
Matthew - October 9, 2008
That's what I thought until I read Kim Ng where most newspapers seem to say it's pronounced Kim Ang
Corco - October 9, 2008
So it is Nig?
Robert - October 9, 2008
I think you have your letters transposed.
JI - October 9, 2008
Though now I'm curious why Ng is interviewing this week since the Dodgers are still alive.
Teej - October 8, 2008
What does a Asst. GM do in the NLCS
Robert - October 8, 2008
Scouting? Observation? Planning?
JI - October 8, 2008
Isn't that what scouts do?
seattlebruin - October 8, 2008
Day to day operations?
JI - October 8, 2008
The position isn't very public
And maybe the Dodgers are thankful for us taking Bavasi off their hands!
Robert - October 8, 2008
They owe us Ethier for that.
.Taylor - October 8, 2008
MLB doesn't like teams announcing major org moves during the playoffs
so even if they do hire someone next week, in all likelihood it won’t be made public until November.
pdb - October 8, 2008
The news blackout in during the WS.
JI - October 8, 2008
And the Mariners broke it with Bill Bavasi back in 03
Robert - October 8, 2008
And A-Rod/Boras last year.
Wilder. - October 8, 2008
From Stones article on Friday
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/mariners/2008224010_mari03.html
Robert - October 8, 2008
I'm feeling sick again.
Matthew - October 8, 2008
Dan Evans?
DANGER DANGER AWOOOGA
JI - October 8, 2008
It's actually kinda incredible that they managed to name those two
Robert - October 8, 2008
Randy Smith is someone who would have been said as a bad joke a month ago.
JI - October 8, 2008
At least we would finally be at the floor
Nowhere to go but up
Robert - October 8, 2008
What floor?
Coach Owens - October 8, 2008
No matter how hard I try I still can't lose more than 118 games on Baseball Mogul
Robert - October 8, 2008
Make an expansion team and don't have a draft
JI - October 8, 2008
Oh ok so the floor is that if the mariners become a expansion team and the MLB deems that Randy Smith doesn't need a expansion draft
Robert - October 8, 2008
I've been saying for months that there is a floor.
JI - October 8, 2008
Having no MLB team at all is worse than that.
Matthew - October 8, 2008
Remember how a bunch of people were happy that the Sonics moved because they could finally be honest about how they actually hated basketball
Robert - October 8, 2008
Remember how some people are still pissed off that our team was taken from us??
>:(
Thingray - October 8, 2008
:(
Dewey N - October 8, 2008
Can't see the pic,
but it might just be me.
Thingray - October 8, 2008
No pic, just a sadface
:(
Dewey N - October 8, 2008
This would be bad news for my brain and good news for the website
Jeff Sullivan - October 8, 2008
Bad news for my liver.
Matthew - October 8, 2008
You are very poor at learning lessons
Robert - October 8, 2008
Needs more Littlefield and Bonifay.
Really, I mean, if you want a list of GMs,with histories of FAIL for your interviews, you can’t leave the Pirates and the Rays out (you probably should find some ex-Oriole staffers, too- say, maybe Jim Beattie’s available!). Maybe they could add Syd Thrift as a Special Adviser to the GM for Matters of Incompetence, to be sure that the Mariner franchise could go into a ditch. We wouldn’t want to leave any doubt.
eponymous_coward - October 8, 2008
Chuck Lamar built these Rays!
Robert - October 8, 2008
I think I will be very unhappy
If both the new GM and Manager are ex-Mariner 2nd basemen.
Sec 108 - October 8, 2008
God I hate Joey Cora so much and I just want him to go away
Robert - October 8, 2008
I don't hate him
I just hate what he represents and will be unbelievably angry with the Mariners if they cave in to it and hire him to manage.
pdb - October 8, 2008
Because right now, we're all thrilled with the way the Mariners are run
seattlebruin - October 8, 2008
Wjat if he turns out to be good at his job?
JI - October 8, 2008
This is what I would have said if I was a normal person
Robert - October 8, 2008
Cora's been atop managerial candidate lists for a while now
In this instance I don’t think it’s the 1995 connection that’s fueling the rumors.
Jeff Sullivan - October 8, 2008
Really?
I haven’t heard his name in situations out side of Seattle.
Robert - October 8, 2008
And that's my thing
I’ve never once heard his name in any speculation for any other management job. I’ll be the first to concede I was wrong if he comes in and has success – I just don’t think he would.
pdb - October 8, 2008
Off the top of my head I remember hearing him connected to Florida and New York
Jeff Sullivan - October 8, 2008
I would feel bad if he became the Willie Randolph Token Minority Candidate.
pdb - October 8, 2008
I just like the idea of an entire baseball team having to answer to a six year old
Jeff Sullivan - October 8, 2008
that would be pretty comical.
pdb - October 8, 2008
If he wears steel toe boots he'll get some respect in the clubhouse
Sec 108 - October 8, 2008
You want to see crying?
I’LL SHOW YOU CRYING, LOSER!!!!!!
that plus a swift kick in the shins would be a great motivational tool.
pdb - October 8, 2008
I never for one second thought that we could follow John McLaren with someone wussier
Jeff Sullivan - October 8, 2008
I nominate
Matthew - October 8, 2008
I'd like to see Carlos Silva try to throw that through a wall
Jeff Sullivan - October 8, 2008
I as well.
We don’t have to pay Silva if he dies from being fucking destroyed do we?
Matthew - October 8, 2008
According to the contract site, no we don't
seattlebruin - October 8, 2008
Should I report you to the law enforcement agencies now?
Slurvey - October 8, 2008
Yes, totally.
Matthew - October 8, 2008
We need a easier transition from the current regime
Robert - October 8, 2008
GM - Bret Boone
Manager – Harold Reynolds.
Phil Hatzenbuehler - October 8, 2008
Adrian Beltre could return to 2004 form!
Robert - October 8, 2008
If he's still here.
.Taylor - October 8, 2008
Asst GM - Jack Perconte
Sec 108 - October 8, 2008
Steroids - prevalent
and = HGH
seattlebruin - October 8, 2008
Please.
Llewdor - October 8, 2008
YES!
I would do near anything to make this occur.
Fez - October 8, 2008
THE BOONE for GM
Gomez - October 8, 2008
I don't think Raul has much of a shot at the Hutch Award
I’m gonna say it’s going to Baldelli, Davis or Lester
seattlebruin - October 8, 2008
Baldelli would probably fall asleep during the ceremony
JI - October 8, 2008
Baldelli's Beds is my favorite charitable organization
Robert - October 8, 2008
I'm happy with all of these guys except Bernazard.
.Taylor - October 8, 2008
Can we resurrect Bill Veeck?
Because that would be amazing.
Two Rs and Two Ls - October 8, 2008
Or Charlie O. Finley!
Coach Owens - October 8, 2008
I'd even be OK with Buzzie Bavasi...
PositivePaul - October 8, 2008
Escalator of Nepotism
The Moving Staircase of Icarus
Llewdor - October 8, 2008
Any thoughts on who is going to be manager?
I hear Cora’s name being tossed around a lot and Dan Wilson at one point to.
Slurvey - October 8, 2008
Hey, how about not hiring a former Mariner?
How about getting an actual good manager?
Coach Owens - October 8, 2008
Um I never said go get them now I just said those were some of the most common names tossed around.
I for one don’t really care who our manager so I was getting a view of what you guys thought about them I think I’d settle for Yost though.
Slurvey - October 8, 2008
I still want Bobby Valentine
if we could coax him out of Japan.
I know it’s been done to death but I’ve always liked the guy.
Patrick517 - October 8, 2008
I wouldn't mind getting him, but I doubt you'll pry him out of Japan.
Cora I’m also okay with, but Wilson has never managed at any level, why would he even be a candidate?
Thingray - October 8, 2008
FORMER MARINER!
Coach Owens - October 8, 2008
Cora is a legitimate candidate.
But name me one manager who got a major league job with no prior coaching experience.
Thingray - October 8, 2008
Larry Dierker comes to mind
Sec 108 - October 8, 2008
Sweet Lou?
Coach Owens - October 8, 2008
This guy.
.Taylor - October 8, 2008
He's a catcher! Catchers make good managers!
Nostalgia! Happy old ladies! Knit & Pitch!
Double06 - October 8, 2008
I wasn't talking about you, just about the Mariners.
They’re idiots if they hire Wilson or Cora just because they’re former M’s.
Coach Owens - October 8, 2008
Please
Take Tony B off our hands.
future - October 8, 2008
If Woodfork gets hired, I wonder if he'll actually post over here and/or USSM once in a while like he does the DBacks equivalent.
Goose - October 8, 2008
We would need to close comments first
Robert - October 8, 2008
I imagine he would get tired of us constantly asking him why he hasn't hired us yet.
Matthew - October 8, 2008
Well he should though...
Slurvey - October 8, 2008
Why would he do that when he can read the blog for free?
Aaron Campeau - October 8, 2008
Like we share our best ideas with you plebs.
Matthew - October 8, 2008
Yeah...
Slurvey - October 8, 2008
I'll take this to mean tRA is two seasons behind your most advanced metrics and you have exclusive access to Hit FX beta.
Aaron Campeau - October 8, 2008
I already have 2009 data
Matthew - October 8, 2008
Don't we win 75 games?
Graham MacAree - October 8, 2008
You guys are always so right
http://www.lookoutlanding.com/2008/4/20/427747/4-20-open-game-thread#5126754
Robert - October 8, 2008
What's the DBacks equivalant of USSM?
I need some extra good reading now that Dave is on the bench.
Double06 - October 8, 2008
draysbay I think.
Thingray - October 8, 2008
Yep:
http://www.draysbay.com/
Thingray - October 8, 2008
Backs, not Rays.
I know of RJ’s work there and at BtBS.
Double06 - October 8, 2008
The SBN Dbacks blog isn't great.
.Taylor - October 8, 2008
I know.
That’s why I don’t go. I wasn’t talking about SBN blogs.
Double06 - October 8, 2008
It's decent at times.
The commenting blows though. For one thing the guy that runs it has a “no cussing” rule.
Every once in a while his stuff is a decent read, but I don’t comment there, and it certainly isn’t my first stop for DBacks related stuff.
Goose - October 8, 2008
Perhaps I worded that wrong. There isn't(at least to my knowledge) a Dbacks equivalent to USSM necessarily
just a Dbacks equivalent to Dave/Derek that all post here.
Woodfork has posted there a few times, as has Josh Byrnes and Derek Hall(Hall has the most posts out of those guys I think). I know a few players read the place, but I don’t know if any post.
The point is, it would be cool to have some Mariners participation around here. Weather it be players or what have you.
Goose - October 8, 2008
Doesn't LSB get player and/or front office posts?
Double06 - October 8, 2008
Yeah. CJ Wilson and Brandon McCarthy have both posted over there.
Goose - October 8, 2008
I'd wish a M's player would post here.
Slurvey - October 8, 2008
SeaninSoCal might be Ryan Rowland Smith
Corco - October 8, 2008
I'm actually still reasonably convinced of this
seattlebruin - October 8, 2008
As am I
Corco - October 8, 2008
You'd want Silva threatening to throw us against a wall?
Coach Owens - October 8, 2008
I actually think this would be hilarious
Corco - October 8, 2008
Yes. Yes I would.
Double06 - October 8, 2008
No
Robert - October 8, 2008
Exactly.
Coach Owens - October 8, 2008
2-1 Yes to no.
.Taylor - October 8, 2008
LL is a meritocracy.
Aaron Campeau - October 8, 2008
If our GM posted even sporadically on here or USSM that's a huge step forward
Bavasi was the man and was pretty open to come talk at feeds which was really cool but I have little reason to believe he actually read USSM or LL, which I think Woodfork would probably do to some extent
Corco - October 8, 2008
It's not even that reading the blogs and culling our ideas is necessarily something that needs to happen
It’s just a large step forward in making the front office more transparent and transparency lends itself to spending more time reasoning out decisions which is good
Corco - October 8, 2008
I'm pretty sure they're afraid of us
Jeff Sullivan - October 8, 2008
Lord knows RR-S is never going to post here.
BrianL - October 8, 2008
Thank Brett for that! >:(
Coach Owens - October 8, 2008
Nah, just Graham.
Coach Owens - October 8, 2008
Not difficult.
.Taylor - October 8, 2008
:)
Dewey N - October 8, 2008
>L)
Robert - October 8, 2008
various notes from above ....
other “no experience” first-time managers? Joe Torre, Jim Fregosi, Bob Brenly, Lou Boudreau, Jerry Coleman, Willie Randolph, Don Baylor, Ray Knight ….
Cora? three minor league managerial stints, as well as his time as GM of the Caguas baseball team, and interviews with the Mets, Pirates and Nationals
msb - October 9, 2008
You must Login with your SB Nation account and be a member of Lookout Landing to post a comment.