Thanks for everything, JJ.
To Seattle:
Aaron Heilman
Franklin Gutierrez
Mike Carp
Endy Chavez
To New York:
JJ Putz
Jeremy Reed
Sean Green
To Cleveland:
Joe Smith
Luis Valbuena
There may be another prospect in there somewhere, but who knows. There are the major names.
0 recs | 587 comments
We haven't won a deal in in over 4 decades!
JI - December 10, 2008
I would love to see JJ take K-Rod's job
JI - December 10, 2008
After that I'd love to see K-Rod lose the setup job to Sean Green.
BrianL - December 10, 2008
Wednesdays with Franklin Gutierrez
just doesn’t have the same ring to it
Will Kier - December 10, 2008
Were Tuesdays with Sean Green conditional on him playing for the M's?
FlaskInSafeco - December 10, 2008
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
seriously that was by far the best part of LL
Jack Moore - December 10, 2008
Zuh?
I just got home from a 13-hour day. What happened?
katal - December 10, 2008
Hmmm..
JJ, Reed, Green
—> Mets→ M’sHeilman, Endy Chavez (?), Franklin Gutierrez, Matt Capp -
Valbuena, Joe Smith
-→ IndiansJI - December 10, 2008
Stupid 2.0 strikethrough
JI - December 10, 2008
blink
katal - December 10, 2008
Ignore the strike throughs
JI - December 10, 2008
How to tell if there's been big news regarding the Mariners by checking USSM
“Error establishing a database connection”
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
I'm sure you'll be able to find Dave on Fangraphs
Jeff Sullivan - December 10, 2008
Pravda has it.
Link
JY - December 10, 2008
Who are we giving up?
katal - December 10, 2008
Putz, Reed, Green, Valbuena.
BrianL - December 10, 2008
You mean
Putz, Reed, Green,
Valbuena.I like this.
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
Oh, wait, damnit.
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
Per MLB.com he's going to Cleveland
Nick S - December 10, 2008
Who is?
JI - December 10, 2008
Valbuena
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
Obviously
JI - December 10, 2008
Not as happy that Valbuena's in it.
We need middle infielders with non-crappy defense.
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
Dominoes! Dominoes!
Aaron Campeau - December 10, 2008
All told, though, this beats any Bavasi trade by a million miles.
And Loafie and Wlad could still get flipped. So yeah.
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
No mention of the Indian minor leaguers?
Goose - December 10, 2008
Pravda wouldn't know until someone told them.
It’s just further confirmation at this point.
JY - December 10, 2008
WE WON A TRADE WE WON A TRADE
DANCE NAKED
JI - December 10, 2008
After you.
BrianL - December 10, 2008
Halfway there.
Aaron Campeau - December 10, 2008
I took my coat off.
royalcurve - December 10, 2008
Been there, done that.
Slica - December 10, 2008
Holy fuck
Welcome to Sexytropolis City, we just pulled off a great deal
Nick S - December 10, 2008
Really?
I think the Mets got the best of this one. Heilman, Chavez and Smith for Putz, Reed and Green?
Adavantage, Omar.
tait644 - December 10, 2008
Actually, yeah.
But the Mariners still did quite well.
Aaron Campeau - December 10, 2008
And 4 minor leaguers.
Matthew - December 10, 2008
Well at that point I didn't realize Valbuena was part of it, but we still came out ahead
Nick S - December 10, 2008
Are we positive Chavez is ours?
JI - December 10, 2008
Offical sites have it that way.
Goose - December 10, 2008
It makes more sense if he goes to Cleveland.
JI - December 10, 2008
No kidding
I mean, it’s neat to add another guy I wanted us to get, but what?
Jeff Sullivan - December 10, 2008
Crossing my fingers
But if we get Chavez there’s really no downside here at all
JI - December 10, 2008
Can I ask what's great about Chavez?
I look at him and I see a 30 year old who hasn’t done a whole lot.
katal - December 10, 2008
Awesome defense
Jeff Sullivan - December 10, 2008
No gaping platoon split
(I think)
JI - December 10, 2008
Ah
Now I’m remembering that postseason catch…
katal - December 10, 2008
Wicked awesome.
Aaron Campeau - December 10, 2008
Baker says we're getting him too
It think it’s legit
JI - December 10, 2008
Yeah.
Weird.
Goose - December 10, 2008
THUNDER! (ah aha aha ah ah aha ah aha ah)
I don’t know if we were supposed to but every time THUNDER came up I yelled J! J!
Slurvey - December 10, 2008
I did too.
royalcurve - December 10, 2008
Chavez doesn't excite me
katal - December 10, 2008
He's a much better 4th OF than Reed.
BrianL - December 10, 2008
Sure
But having a good 4th OF is low on my list of priorities.
katal - December 10, 2008
Get better where you can get better
Chavez is icing
JI - December 10, 2008
Not a bad idea to get one thrown in though
Jeff Sullivan - December 10, 2008
Thunderstruck is an awesome kind of requiem for the departure of an awesome Mariner.
Slurvey - December 10, 2008
shit, now that you mention it
With JJ leaving, I need a new ring tone.
katal - December 10, 2008
I'm keeping it. I loved JJ, but love AC/DC more.
kevin_ess - December 10, 2008
Okay that just made me really sad.
Aaron Campeau - December 10, 2008
I said goodbye to Good JJ long ago
JI - December 10, 2008
Even though he was bad this year it was still a blast when he came in.
Aaron Campeau - December 10, 2008
Bah
Write a really long trade analysis and can’t submit it because you all crashed our server again. Jerks.
davidcameron - December 10, 2008
Sorry.
I checked USSM, saw the server was down, and thus came here.
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
It was thunderstruck...
Got to get all of these out of my system…
Slurvey - December 10, 2008
600 comments here
be glad we took as much strain away from USSM as we did
JI - December 10, 2008
I know where you can submit it!
Jeff Sullivan - December 10, 2008
Fangraphs?
JI - December 10, 2008
I made the same joke to Jeff by email
davidcameron - December 10, 2008
I stole it from him in the other thread
JI - December 10, 2008
Burnt Orange Report.
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
Also:
This wouldn’t be a problem if you wrote a political blog…
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
I swear I only tried to load the page once.
BrianL - December 10, 2008
I set up a bot to auto-refresh because I hate competition
Jeff Sullivan - December 10, 2008
Okay, fine
Rosenthal says it’s a done deal. From the M’s perspective, this is what’s being reported:
M’s trade RHP J.J. Putz, RHP Sean Green, OF Jeremy Reed, and 2B Luis Valbuena for OF Franklin Gutierrez, RHP Aaron Heilman, OF Endy Chavez, 1B Mike Carp, and “minor leaguers” from Cleveland.
Z’s first significant trade is certainly a big one – probably the most interesting trade the M’s have pulled off in five years. Let’s break down the pieces by win value.
Putz (2 wins), Green (1 win), Reed (0.5 wins), and Valbuena (1 win) represent a net loss of about 4.5 wins over replacement level players. Combined, they’ll make about $7 million in 2009, so it’s definitely a valuable group of players – productive and cheap. Putz and Valbuena are the real pieces of value, though – Reed and Green are role players. Valbuena could be a league average second baseman pretty quickly, and the Indians did well to spot him as a guy who could help them long term. I hate giving up Valbuena, as I was hopeful the M’s would sell high on Lopez and keep Luis as his replacement.
However, the M’s aren’t getting a bunch of crap in return.
Gutierrez is a +2 win OF (yes, even with a questionable bat, he’s a league average player) who instantly solves the center field problem. Heilman is a +1 win reliever with an undefined role. He wants to start but isn’t good enough to, so if they can convince him to close, that’s in everyone’s best interests. Chavez is a +1 win OF who will probably share time with Wlad (like Gutierrez, his defense is other worldly), and Carp is a +0 win prospect with moderate upside – think Lyle Overbay if he develops well.
The M’s ship off about +4.5 wins and get back +4 wins, so you could call it a big push overall, but that’s where the nuances come in. Here are the reasons I like this deal:
1. The +2 win player the M’s are getting back is much younger than the +2 win player they’re giving up, and they have him under team control for a lot longer. For where this team is, Gutierrez is more valuable than Putz.
2. One of Valbuena or Lopez had to go, because there was no way for them to coexist at full value. In that sense, the M’s swapped a prospect at a position of depth for a prospect at a position where they have a gaping hole. I like Valbuena better than Carp, but Carp has a much clearer road to a job in Seattle.
3. By acquiring Gutierrez and Chavez, the M’s just have given themselves the ability to run out of the best outfield defenses in baseball on days where they send a contact pitcher to the hill. A Chavez/Gutierrez/Ichiro outfield will make Silva and Washburn look significantly better than they really are, and by investing in the defense, the M’s have made it possible that they could salvage some value from a pair of bad contracts.
To me, those three things swing this trade into the plus column for the M’s. That doesn’t make it a total home run – Heilman’s desire to start and the loss of Putz and Green make it much more likely that Morrow’s going to remain in the bullpen, Chavez is only under team control for one year, and Gutierrez’s right-handed bat isn’t a great fit for Safeco.
But in this case, I’d say the positive outweigh the negatives. It’s not an outright fleecing like Putz for Joyce would have been (and if that was on the table, I’d have done that before I did this, but it’s quite possible that was never offered), but I’d say that the Mariners are better right now than they were yesterday and they have a brighter future, and that makes this a good trade.
davidcameron - December 10, 2008
Dammit I wasn't serious
Now I need to come up with original thoughts.
Jeff Sullivan - December 10, 2008
Hide it you moron
JI - December 10, 2008
Rec'd for good advice.
Fin - December 10, 2008
Liar
Bearskin Rugburn - December 10, 2008
Does this conflict with your regular schedule?
Slica - December 10, 2008
USSM's up now
For me, anyway.
Fett42 - December 10, 2008
Gutierrez looks like a poor man's Mike Cameron.
Not as good, but same sort of skills.
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
This blows my mind
Robert - December 10, 2008
You remember Winn/Cameron/Ichiro?
Yeah. Good times.
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
The amazing thing was they were good offensively too
Fett42 - December 10, 2008
Yup.
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
This trade could potentially make Ichiro the least skilled outfielder on the field at any given time, couldn't it?
BrianL - December 10, 2008
LATE
JI - December 10, 2008
Dammit.
BrianL - December 10, 2008
Puttin Morrow back into the pen?
Heilman says he wants to start, but Morrow also said he doesn’t want to go back to the pen.
Why would we listen to Heilman?
bon_ton - December 10, 2008
Seriously, Morrow has proven that he could be hell of a starter.
But I suppose Heilman kind of has too, I remember watching him pitch a one hitter against the Marlins back in 2005, so he could be good.
Fin - December 10, 2008
Nice rundown, I was looking at the numbers and just scratching my head as to why this is good.
If these guys can improve the outfield defense then terrific!
dpseadv - December 10, 2008
great deal for the Ms but...
god damn it I’m gonna miss JJ. I had that unconditional love for him similar to the average fan’s love for Willie. I’m half-depressed, half-excited
IceStormV1 - December 10, 2008
This will be me when Beltre goes.
Aaron Campeau - December 10, 2008
It's times like this that my anger over the Bedard trade returns
katal - December 10, 2008
dammit, didn't mean to hit send
… going on… I was about to say, the number of talented youth on this team would have been insane.
katal - December 10, 2008
Also our previous trades with Cleveland.
JY - December 10, 2008
Sorry if this has been posted:
http://blog.seattletimes.nwsource.com/mariners/2008/12/10/previous_threeway_deal_had_col.html
Toxicadam - December 10, 2008
You're
also getting Jason Vargas.
And Jeff, answer your fucking phone.
future - December 10, 2008
Was busy
Jeff Sullivan - December 10, 2008
Gutierrez should be our CF
And if you disagree, then just copy and paste this link in your browser. http://mlb.mlb.com/media/video.jsp?mid=200806092880532&c_id=cle
Turdburglar - December 10, 2008
god
he doesn’t even take a good angle to that and he gets it
ridiculous
Jack Moore - December 10, 2008
From Baker...
“As well, they get three more minor leaguers from the Mets, right handed pitcher Maikel Cleto, outfielder Ezequiel Carrera and left handed pitcher Jason Vargas.”
Slurvey - December 10, 2008
It's a freaking killing
You guys got a ton for Putz. Way to leverage our need for bullpen arms that don’t suck.
Also, I think you will have the greatest outfield defense of all time with Endy, Gutierrez and Ichiro out there.
future - December 10, 2008
Winn, Cameron, Ichiro will be tough to top
JI - December 10, 2008
This may be sacrilege
but I trust GMZ with minor leaguers more than even Fontaine. The more prospects we get in this trade, the better.
katal - December 10, 2008
Hmmm.
I don’t see it as sacrilege. My thoughts on “Saint Fontaine” have been spelled out somewhat clearly here. He’s far from perfect, and I trust Zduriencik more myself, too.
PositivePaul - December 10, 2008
Wait what?
Corco - December 10, 2008
This is Ezequiel Carrera.
Aaron Campeau - December 10, 2008
At least it's not Ezequiel Astacio
Nick S - December 10, 2008
That would have ruled.
JI - December 10, 2008
LOL astacio is uggs
JI - December 10, 2008
Or Pedro Astacio.
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
Good lord!
Goose - December 10, 2008
Holy fucking shit
3 more propspects, If this is true GMZ just pulled off a robbery.
IceStormV1 - December 10, 2008
Are the worth a shit?
JI - December 10, 2008
In my worthless opinion, they're nothing too exciting but not totally terrible either.
Aaron Campeau - December 10, 2008
`
Cleto
Carrera
Vargas
Matthew - December 10, 2008
Hey, Cleto is 19.
That makes things a bit more interesting.
Aaron Campeau - December 10, 2008
Looks like Vargas is roster filler
JI - December 10, 2008
Situational lefty?
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
Wow.
Vargas helps solve out lack of bullpen lefties problem.
Cleto’s a reasonably interesting young arm who was competent, but not dominating in a league he was too young for.
Carrera’s a young left-handed outfield. Not much else I know about him/
JY - December 10, 2008
I LEAVE THE COMPUTER FOR 2 HOURS AND THIS HAPPENS
HUZZZZAH 1
Corco - December 10, 2008
Good night with GU smacking the Cougs and this trade.
Win.
SethGrandpa - December 10, 2008
I feel happy!
This feeling…. it’s so foreign…..
It’s like Morrow’s 1-hitter all over again.
.Taylor - December 10, 2008
Suddenly
I want Fields signed.
katal - December 10, 2008
I'd rather have the pick.
BrianL - December 10, 2008
I'd rather have Morrow start
katal - December 10, 2008
Has nothing to do with Fields
JI - December 10, 2008
I disagree
Then again, GMZ knows whether he wants Morrow in the pen or not. I trust he’ll do what’s best.
katal - December 10, 2008
I figure making Heilman the closer may calm him down because
Promotion!
JI - December 10, 2008
I just went from pissed to stoked to pissed to FUCK YES THIS IS AWESOME
Corco - December 10, 2008
I am still nonplussed.
Matthew - December 10, 2008
It isn't anything spectacular
but that’s for the Beltre trade.
katal - December 10, 2008
Clarifying
The trade is spectacular. I’m very pleased.
I meant that none of the players are A-level.
Thatis for when we trade Adrian Beltre.katal - December 10, 2008
There's just too much to process.
Did we just trade 4 guys and get back 7?
Matthew - December 10, 2008
If you factor in the Bedard trade, we're only down by 1.
This is like a baseball mogul trade
JI - December 10, 2008
We need to figure out a way to break the financial AI.
Robert - December 10, 2008
Why?
Dewey N - December 10, 2008
We did not rape them
but it’s a lot better then a Bavasi trade and does help us out
My brain still can’t accept that Endy Chavez is good though
Corco - December 10, 2008
Lets put it this way
Endy Chavez is a defensive fucking god. Thou shalt appreciate him.
future - December 10, 2008
visitor from Royals Review
and Franklin Gutierrez looks like Endy, Jr. Except he’s familiar with this “hitting” all the kids are raving about.
I hate you all.
Matt Klaassen - December 10, 2008
I believe it but my brain doesn't
Corco - December 10, 2008
I hate his guts
JI - December 10, 2008
but now if he hurts the Cardinals in the postseason, it will be in the World Series.
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
Scott Spiezio won me the World Series
I’ll get over it.
JI - December 10, 2008
Fuck Player A
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
Being pessimistic for the sake of being pessimistic?
.Taylor - December 10, 2008
No.
Nonplussed doesn’t mean what you seem to think it means.
Matthew - December 10, 2008
Dictionary.com says you're right.
.Taylor - December 10, 2008
Nonplussed does not mean disappointed.
Aaron Campeau - December 10, 2008
Fuck. My emotions are running the gamut. Sorry you won't be singing Thunderstruck anymore, Silas, but we just made a great deal.
Can I keep the JJ poster up?
kevin_ess - December 10, 2008
Good stuff
baetown415 - December 10, 2008
this team will not score a lot of runs but will catch every fucking ball hit into the outfield
Corco - December 10, 2008
Suddenly Jarrod Washburn really, really wants to stay in Seattle next year...
esoteric - December 10, 2008
Suddenly, I'm a little excited for Jarrod Washburn starts
seattlebruin - December 10, 2008
But how much is this greatly-improved OF defense really going to impact him?
I know he’s an extreme fly-ball pitcher, but still.
.Taylor - December 11, 2008
Remember when Ryan Franklin won 17 games for us and everyone thought he as a great pitcher?
seattlebruin - December 11, 2008
Oh God, you were like eight this happened, huh?
seattlebruin - December 11, 2008
At least I was in middle school...
I think…What year was that?
BrianL - December 11, 2008
Franklin won 11 games in 2003.
But that’s the most wins he ever had in a season.
Are you thinking Pineiro? This was in the four-year span where I pretty much stopped paying attention to baseball, so I don’t remember it well.
Teej - December 11, 2008
Maybe he is remembering Paul Abbott
Sec 108 - December 12, 2008
Fuck, it must have been Abbott
for some reason I always mix those two up
seattlebruin - December 14, 2008
The same way having a great outfield helped him in Anaheim, I imagine.
So . . . he’ll get a big contract after 2009. My guess is with the Reds.
Teej - December 11, 2008
the minor leaguers we got
They don’t look too bad. Obviously Carp is the prize of the group, but Astacio looks like a good, speedy outfielder who knows how to take a walk, and Vargas looks like a decent loogy candidate.
Turdburglar - December 10, 2008
Carrera, you mean.
Not Astacio.
JY - December 10, 2008
Polarizing Trade
Seems like half the M’s fans like this and half hate this.
I think it’s a solid trade. At first I hated it knowing how poorly Gutierrez hit last year but then I remembered he is a pretty damn good defender.
The other pieces are also solid. Heilman could start or close and it wasn’t too long ago that he was a pretty good setup man. Either way he’s another piece we could flip for valve later on. And getting 4 interesting though not spectular minor leaguers is also pretty solid.
thebiz - December 10, 2008
Who hates this trade?
Matthew - December 10, 2008
Idiots?
Goose - December 10, 2008
The entire KJR staff and their listeners
but they don’t count.
BrianL - December 10, 2008
So, idiots, then, right?
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
Pretty much, yes.
BrianL - December 10, 2008
Let's just say Baker's commenters have a different view
Or, what Goose said
Nick S - December 10, 2008
http://community.seattletimes.nwsource.com/reader_feedback/public/display.php?source_name=movabletype&source_id=35202
JI - December 10, 2008
I initially hated this trade
but once I saw the defense! part of it I realized it was good
Corco - December 10, 2008
I initially hated this trade
but once I read what Dave and Jeff had to say about it I realized it was good, seeing as I get virtually all my baseball opinions from them.
.Taylor - December 10, 2008
thats what everyone does
But no one will admit it
outtathequestion - December 10, 2008
Many of my MC folks are against this. I'm trying to talk sense into them.
Uphill battle.
kevin_ess - December 10, 2008
I can see why, defense doesn't jump off the page like an offensive line.
I’m looking forward to watching these guys roam the outfield.
dpseadv - December 10, 2008
but, but ....
KJR says we should be really disappointed in Zduriencik’s first deal.
msb - December 10, 2008
KJR needs to have Dave on more often so people will be less stupid.
BrianL - December 10, 2008
Call them up and tell them to go fuck themselves
JI - December 10, 2008
I want to run up to the Gasman and hit him squarely in the face with an Endy Chavez bobblehead.
.Taylor - December 10, 2008
This is why I said that Z wont be the GM when we win but he will be the reason
Robert - December 10, 2008
He'a bald Paul DePodesta?
JI - December 10, 2008
I get the opinion that Z can't swear and says dog gummit alot
Robert - December 10, 2008
dangnabbit
JI - December 10, 2008
Z has people skills.
DePo, not so much.
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
KJR promoted Ian Furness and demoted Dave Grosby.
Groz was pretty much the only one with knowledge on that whole staff.
BrettJMiller - December 10, 2008
I pray that Groz takes a job at KIRO.
BrianL - December 10, 2008
well, not really.
Groz was the one whose contract was up just as KJR was ready to retrench.
msb - December 10, 2008
So we're trading Heilman, right?
Corco - December 10, 2008
Not right away
JI - December 10, 2008
Hopefully.
.Taylor - December 10, 2008
Well...
we are kinda short on fungible bullpen arms right now.
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
True
but Heilman wants to start, so if we could give him + say Halman for a couple decent bullpen arms that would be great
Corco - December 10, 2008
The fuck?
Why would you deal away Halman for relief help?
Matthew - December 10, 2008
If it were multiple pieces of really good relief help, yes
Corco - December 10, 2008
We're not winning anything in 2009.
Matthew - December 10, 2008
So Heilman+ a C+ prospect then
Corco - December 10, 2008
My guess is that he gets Koch'd to a dumb team in 2010
JI - December 10, 2008
KOCH PUNCH
abender20 - December 10, 2008
also I am wasted right now I
as classes ended tonight so M’s players == >God and other teams players =<Mike Morse
Corco - December 10, 2008
good english. you earned it
abender20 - December 10, 2008
or I'm vastly underrating Heilman and Halman
Corco - December 10, 2008
Halman
Aaron Campeau - December 10, 2008
To quote JI, he's Aaron Heilman.
Whoc ares what he wants?
BrianL - December 10, 2008
Did the Mets ever make him the closer?
I’d say “sorry, we’re full up with starters, but we have this relief ace job open”. Better him than Beluga Tits.
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
Appropriate that perhaps the final TwSG was him going crazy.
Matthew - December 10, 2008
I can't wait until next Tuesday now.
That climax was pretty spectacular. Can’t wait for the denouement…
PositivePaul - December 10, 2008
I don't see how people think Z could've done better than this...
I mean come on, he not only made us better as of right now, but he brought in some prospects as well. And atleast now you can say the mariners are good at SOMETHING. (outfield defense) Instead of nothing, like last year.
Turdburglar - December 10, 2008
People don't know how to properly evaluate defense.
Strike that, people don’t want to look at defense as part of a roster move.
BrianL - December 10, 2008
This is encouraging, I'd like to think Zduriencik is building a team that fits Safeco.
Bavasi just… I don’t know. Didn’t fucking get it.
dpseadv - December 10, 2008
Especially for a possibly broken reliever.
seattlesundevil - December 10, 2008
FWIW, Vargas missed all of 2008 with a hip injury.
So, you know, we’re cornering the market on those.
Matthew - December 10, 2008
Jason Vargas has girl parts?
BrianL - December 10, 2008
He was faking because his agent told him to
JI - December 10, 2008
He was faking so he could get traded to the Mariners to LEAD THEM TO THE WORLD SERIES!!
Oh yeah, I brought it back.
Matthew - December 10, 2008
I wonder how many recs our HOF memes would have gotten on 2.0
Robert - December 10, 2008
I thought Z went for sluggo OF'ers?
Robert - December 10, 2008
I hear that Beltre/Clement for Braun deal is still on the table
JI - December 10, 2008
I heard we're trading Putz for Fielder.
And Rasmus may be involved.
Aaron Campeau - December 10, 2008
We have enough outfielders
JI - December 10, 2008
You can't trade Raben until a year after you draft him.
Robert - December 10, 2008
You can't trade kickers or punters at all.
Aaron Campeau - December 10, 2008
I rather us keep Hass and hope that can make the transition from the WCO a few years down the line.
Robert - December 10, 2008
Hass is 33 and has an injury history.
And he’s never been good on long passes that are the Air Coryell norm.
BrianL - December 10, 2008
We got Durant!
Aaron Campeau - December 10, 2008
Normal "fuck Clay Bennett and David Stern" line here.
BrianL - December 10, 2008
Say what you want about the man's coaching ability
but Willingham will bring the integrity that the program desperately needs right now
Robert - December 10, 2008
And Jim Mora is the next coach of the Hawks!
so we won’t miss a beat…
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
I know Shaun had a lot of carries, but he's the fucking MVP. We HAVE to re-sign him.
Aaron Campeau - December 10, 2008
I'm thinking its going to go Freddy, Blackley, Nageotte, Felix, Johnson
Robert - December 10, 2008
What about Madritsch?
::sobs::
BrianL - December 10, 2008
You can when you're the home team and you change the rules.
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
and pujols
abender20 - December 10, 2008
I miss Zduriencik already :(
Jack Moore - December 10, 2008
You can't have him back!
.Taylor - December 10, 2008
can we at least get a sandwich pick for him
you guys wouldn’t even lose anything
Jack Moore - December 10, 2008
Only if we get a shortstop to replace our old JJ!
And that Gallardo guy. He looks like he has veteran grit.
.Taylor - December 10, 2008
he's pretty scrappy too
Jack Moore - December 10, 2008
We'll give yoiu a sandwich from Denny's
Monte Cristo, with extra jelly.
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
This confused me until I realized you must be a BrewCrew fan..
seattlesundevil - December 10, 2008
I figured the avatar made it kinda obvious
but hey you never know I guess
Jack Moore - December 10, 2008
I turned off avatars on day one of 2.0....
seattlesundevil - December 10, 2008
A lot of people turn those off.
Faux - December 10, 2008
Big threads load like molasses for me if I leave them on.
dpseadv - December 10, 2008
BCB is a little lower traffic than here.
The largest thread I saw there was about 700.
Faux - December 10, 2008
My computer is also 1.8 Ghz, so that probably doesn't help much.
I think the newer computers could probably launch a potato into space on processing power alone, but I haven’t looked at speeds lately. I’d probably just cry.
dpseadv - December 10, 2008
GHz aren't everything.
But if you’re talking like that, it’s probably outdated enough that it wouldn’t matter.
Faux - December 10, 2008
Mac G5. It's gritty and has a lot of hustle. Pretty good situational hitter as well.
It’s 4 years old, in computer years that’s right on the edge of old I think.
dpseadv - December 10, 2008
It's for a good cause!
ThundaPC - December 10, 2008
ok, straighten Elise out on the trade, Churchill
msb - December 10, 2008
Go Jason Go.
BrianL - December 10, 2008
Jason isn't real thrilled.
He thinks they should have gotten something more for JJ.
He did point out the importance of defense.
msb - December 10, 2008
Dammit Jason.
BrianL - December 10, 2008
he could have been a bit more emphatic.
and Elise took it that she should still be disappointed. she supports the rebuilding, but thinks they should have gotten Mike Carp and a couple of ‘better’ minor league prospects — and she missed his explanation that Green & Reed are easily replaceable parts
msb - December 10, 2008
Alright Groz go call Dave and bring him on tomorrow.
BrianL - December 10, 2008
Well, if it had been JJ=>Joyce straight up, it would have been better.
You figure JJ HAS to be more valuable to the Tigers than Edwin Jackson, though the Tigers were stupid enough to trade Joyce for Jackson, so who knows.
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
So Maikel Cleto
Our answer to Chone?
Bearskin Rugburn - December 10, 2008
Cleto is at least a Latin player.
Aaron Campeau - December 10, 2008
We have a Mayckol too.
He may be up from the VSL soon.
JY - December 10, 2008
There's a Maykel that used to play for the Sounders as well
Nick S - December 10, 2008
My Tuesdays are ruined.
SkipT - December 10, 2008
He moved to New York, he's not dead
JI - December 10, 2008
Tell that to Robert.
Matthew - December 10, 2008
Que?
Robert - December 10, 2008
Oh now I get it.
Robert - December 10, 2008
I don't.
JI - December 10, 2008
Too bad.
Robert - December 10, 2008
I love you, Robert. You fucking crack me up.
kevin_ess - December 10, 2008
I love the noine minutesin between
Mariner John - December 10, 2008
Yikes
Mariner John - December 10, 2008
Fridays with Franklin!
Nick S - December 10, 2008
Mondays with Mike!
.Taylor - December 10, 2008
what
.Taylor - December 10, 2008
I get my opinions on baseball talent from people who know more than me about baseball talent
and hey look I’m not ashamed of it
Corco - December 10, 2008
and hey, I trust them more because they know more than me
If they started talking about highways I’d chase my intuition but since I know J/M/G/Dave/DMZ know more than me I’ll listen to them
Corco - December 10, 2008
i'll agree with that
Flamefox111 - December 10, 2008
Is this a reply fail to the Churchill and Elise comment? Or is this a big whoosh right over my head?
dpseadv - December 10, 2008
No this is me being drunk and all my friends saying the Mariners got raped
and me saying “Look, people who know more than you do say they got a good deal, and they have good reason to back it all up, so I’m rolling with them”
Corco - December 10, 2008
Oh gotcha. My friends hated Winn and were happy to see him leave. I don't really talk to any of those people anymore.
dpseadv - December 10, 2008
The Foppert/JoeJessica deal was not horrible though
Corco - December 10, 2008
I've been listening to nothing but Thunderstruck for the last few hours
This is getting unhealthy…
Slurvey - December 10, 2008
Quick comment on those prospects from NY
“Cleto is a 19-year-old with a 94-97 mph fastball and has a potientially bright future as either a starter and closer and Carerra looks to be a Juan Pierre with more power”
bon_ton - December 10, 2008
We really gave up a fuck-ton in this deal
I hope Putz is worth it.
future - December 10, 2008
Source?
JY - December 10, 2008
Link in a comment on mlbtraderumors
http://futureamazins.com/?p=246
bon_ton - December 10, 2008
Normally I like BTF's transaction analysis
But not this time
Goose - December 10, 2008
Jeremy Reed on Google
Jeremy Reed is #1 on Google Hot Trends right now. First and last time for everything!
http://www.google.com/trends/hottrends
solap1 - December 10, 2008
haha
how did you even notice that.
This is all the Mets fans trying to figure out who the hell he is.
outtathequestion - December 10, 2008
RSS feed
Me <= nerd
solap1 - December 10, 2008
It looks that all the people the Mets got are in the top 20.
I suppose if you have 8 million people googling these guys at once, that’ll do it.
Fin - December 10, 2008
HAHAHAHAHA!
Slurvey - December 10, 2008
Hilarious!
royalcurve - December 10, 2008
Number 51 is surprisingly specific
JLC - December 10, 2008
And JJ is number 10
while Sean Green takes number 31
JMKaustin - December 10, 2008
JJ or J J
JJ may be 10, but J J is 49.
solap1 - December 10, 2008
Alright everyone, I gotta actually get some work done tonight
So I am gonna check out for awhile.. What a fun night though!
seattlesundevil - December 10, 2008
I love the Mariners
Dewey N - December 10, 2008
Lopez and Yuni are the next to go
JI - December 10, 2008
This move basically established that Lopez will be the starter this season!
and Yuni is untouchable
Dewey N - December 10, 2008
The New Flagship Station of the Ms
Sports
Yankees land Sabathia, a $161 million man
The New York Yankees landed a big prize for their new ballpark. CC Sabathia and the Yankees agreed Wednesday to the framework of a $161 million, seven-year contract after general manager Brian Cashman dashed off to California to meet with the pitcher and his wife.
updated 1 min. ago
* Yankees land Sabathia, a $161 million man (updated 1 min. ago)
* Putz goes to Mets in 3-team trade with Indians (updated 18 min. ago)
* No. 4 Gonzaga beats Washington State 74-52 (updated 28 min. ago)
msb - December 10, 2008
ZAGS
JI - December 10, 2008
Way to go KIRO.
BrianL - December 10, 2008
But hey, at least they have Bill Swartz blogging for them!
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
HIRE DRAYER ALREADY
BrianL - December 10, 2008
my hope is that his missing on this trade finally gets their atention
msb - December 10, 2008
and man is it painful.
msb - December 10, 2008
as far as I can tell
their Sports Director (who sent himself to the Winter Meetings) spent his whole time sightseeing, going to shows and occasionally going through the lobby and talking to those former Mariner FO guys he recognised.
msb - December 10, 2008
LATE
AND I MEAN REALLY LATE
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
oh, I've been bitching about it for the last week....
msb - December 10, 2008
May Putz need Tommy John Surgery
Corco - December 10, 2008
What? Fuck that/you.
Eyebrows - December 10, 2008
I hope JJ smacks for the Mets
but that’s about the only player I want to do well for a NY team.
outtathequestion - December 10, 2008
What??
royalcurve - December 10, 2008
Fuck you in the eye with a squirrel
May JJ own all manner of ass.
Graham MacAree - December 10, 2008
Not a squirrel. How about a nutria?
kevin_ess - December 10, 2008
Only one hesitation....
This doesn’t improve our incredibly stagnant offense one bit.
That’s next. We need a DH, and we need power (or at least, gap power.)
Who do we go after now? What’s left to trade away? Beltre?
J.W. Pezzino - December 10, 2008
The gain in OF defense offsets the loss of Raul's bat.
Aaron Campeau - December 10, 2008
I agree with you...
But even with Raul’s bat we didn’t score nearly enough runs.
I guess the real answer is “Hey, we’re rebuilding…gotta take the pain for a little while longer.” Can’t fix the world in one trade.
J.W. Pezzino - December 10, 2008
But it's growing pains instead of the pains of death!
Aaron Campeau - December 10, 2008
The Mariner defense was really, REALLY awful last year, as were 1B/DH+an OF.
It’s quite possible that we’re better on offense AND defense minus Raul, Sexson, Reed and Turbo, with Gutierrez, Chavez, Shelton and Branyan taking their playing time.
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
Runs saved on defense = runs saved on offense.
Also, consider that Branyan and Shelton > Turbo and Sexson.
Also, consider that we just shaved 5 million and change off the payroll. We’re not done yet.
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
er, runs ADDED on offense
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
Runs saved on defence for a rebuilding team that needs to pump up pitcher value > runs gained on offence
Graham MacAree - December 10, 2008
Carlos Silva trade next winter!
Matthew - December 10, 2008
plz
.Taylor - December 11, 2008
Sure, that too.
I actually think we might end up getting rid of one of the Trio of Suck by spring training, truth be told.
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
yeah I think so too
All bets on Washburn.
outtathequestion - December 10, 2008
My guess will Silva could be gone by July 31st.
If the outfield helps him out enough.
Fin - December 10, 2008
Stop being too smart.
Aaron Campeau - December 10, 2008
Chavez in LF
Wlad/Kenji/Clement platoon?
Robert - December 10, 2008
wasnt Maikal Cleto that movie with George Clooney?
abender20 - December 10, 2008
Putz saving his anger for later...
Baker
ThundaPC - December 10, 2008
well
“It’s going to be a challenge” in the sports world = “
#$$%#%%#!!!!!!!!!!!!!”outtathequestion - December 10, 2008
Yeah, he must be real pissed about leaving the Mariners and going to pitch for a competetive team in New York...
Matthew - December 10, 2008
Hurts his FA payoff
JI - December 10, 2008
Not when he steals the closer role from K-Rod
by beating his head in with a bat.
Edgar for Pres - December 10, 2008
he already has said
he doesn’t wanna be a set-up man.
outtathequestion - December 10, 2008
So in other words...
K-rod might end up dead in the next few days?
Slurvey - December 10, 2008
I don't see how you made this conclusion.
.Taylor - December 11, 2008
So this seems like each team wins.
Incredible.
Matthew - December 10, 2008
I love these types of trades.
Aaron Campeau - December 10, 2008
Bullshit
I like screwing the other team over
JI - December 10, 2008
I like the Indians and am indifferent towards the Mets.
Aaron Campeau - December 10, 2008
It still feels good to go to their blog and gloat after the screw job.
JLC - December 10, 2008
Not my style.
Aaron Campeau - December 10, 2008
We have experienced this enough that I wish to not inflict it upon others
Mariner John - December 10, 2008
There's always time for us to lose in the future.
Robert - December 10, 2008
Omar Minaya must have just watched the 2007 Allstar game
Robert - December 10, 2008
Isn't Castillo still their 2nd baseman?
Faux - December 10, 2008
I'm a little concerned that Heilman's tRA has increased in each of his last 4 years (3.21 in '05 to 5.07 in '08).
And his walk rate shot through the roof last year.
Phil Hatzenbuehler - December 10, 2008
luckily
he’ll rack up saves and be a commodity at the deadline
abender20 - December 10, 2008
Walk rate and K rate went bonkers.
Lost some groundballs. I’m guessing he was trying to pitch up more with more fastballs and… well basically had your usual “power pitcher” results.
The Typical Idiot Fan - December 10, 2008
He added a slider and couldn't locate it.
Teej - December 10, 2008
Messed up knee
And with all the over-use that Willie put him through, he needed to heal, he never got that chance.
If he’s healthy, that change-up is devastating. He’s a two pitch pitcher but they’re two awfully good ones.
If the Ms let him try to make the rotation, he can bring back the curveball that Rick Peterson made him drop, which IIRC was actually a good pitch.
future - December 10, 2008
We have about 8 people in the rotation right now.
Matthew - December 10, 2008
7
Morrow is the closer now. /Leftover pessimism
JLC - December 10, 2008
AC/DC
Has never made me so sad. :(
section331 - December 10, 2008
So i shouldn't tell you i got
6th row tickets for the show in Houston Sunday night?
laxtonto - December 10, 2008
Omar Minaya
Just traded for 3 white players…
outtathequestion - December 10, 2008
One of the conditions is that JJ has to change one of his J's to Jesus.
Robert - December 10, 2008
Joseph Jason Jesus Putz
Two Rs and Two Ls - December 10, 2008
O_O
The Typical Idiot Fan - December 10, 2008
Silly Omar
Did he say he wanted Green? He really meant he wanted Silva. Sorry for the mixup, Mets. Hey, since we like you guys, we’ll just give you Silva for free. You can keep Green. No, really, it’s fine.
NO GIVESIES BACKSIES.
outtathequestion - December 10, 2008
holy shit your right
JI - December 10, 2008
I thought Sean Green was an OG.
Slica - December 10, 2008
Newsday Reporting M's Actually Get Seven Players
TroutMask - December 10, 2008
Mentioned ages ago.
ThundaPC - December 10, 2008
Oops.
TroutMask - December 10, 2008
Yup.
Teej - December 10, 2008
Boy you really are late.
The Typical Idiot Fan - December 10, 2008
I still dont understand any Star Trek stuff.
I know there is a Spock with ears and something to do with William Shatner. Oh, and there is a guy who has a face shaped like an Iguana’s back. Thats about it.
Slica - December 10, 2008
I'm probably part of the "Dennis Miller Ratio" here...
But I laughed. :)
J.W. Pezzino - December 10, 2008
The best part is Data's reaction.
Goose - December 11, 2008
Well Shit.
I am still keeping my avatar.
Fin - December 10, 2008
Very courageous to the 5 people who have them enabled. : )
Slica - December 10, 2008
Hmmm...
The Mariners are minus the following 2008 salaries:
Sexson
Raul
Turbo
Putz
And they’ve only added maybe 5 million back or so with Heilman, Branyan, etc, right?
So, basically, they just cleared 25 million off the decks, and didn’t get appreciably worse as a team (in fact, arguably better). Not bad. They could make a nice signing and STILL save money on 2008.
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
Beltre & Felix!!!!
Also, give that Bedard kid some spare change to stick around a few years on the cheap.
Faux - December 10, 2008
Yeah, plus Bedard's arbitration will have to come out of that.
However, they could still ship off (please, please, please) the Washburninator or Beluga Tits.
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
My dad loved Batista the year he won 16 games....
.Taylor - December 11, 2008
You make a good point...
Let’s negate everything by bringing back the “Griffey Nostalgia Tour 2009!”
What?
J.W. Pezzino - December 10, 2008
I said a nice signing.
Rocco Baldelli, for instance.
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
Someone call Copacino + Fujikado and tell them to cancel the Putz ad for '09.
Two Rs and Two Ls - December 10, 2008
This trade
Dewey N - December 10, 2008
How did I miss this?
I hated Lazy Sunday, but this and the Space Olympics crack me up.
Teej - December 10, 2008
I wonder who's gonna be our #3 and 4 hitters?
It seems like we’ve got a whole bunch of guys that hit 1,2,5,6,7,8,9 in most lineups, but noone who is a legit #3 or 4 hitter. Is Zduriencik thinking of picking up another bat, or are we gonna trade Beltre and get more of the same types of guys?
Because Beltre’s about the only one who you could say maybe could be a 3 or 4 guy.
Turdburglar - December 10, 2008
That's the type of thought process that brought us Sexson.
Benne - December 10, 2008
Why does it matter?
Graham MacAree - December 10, 2008
Want some butter for your roles?
Or was that a really fucking lame joke.
The Typical Idiot Fan - December 10, 2008
Yes but I laughed.
Aaron Campeau - December 10, 2008
If only it was December 10 instead of the day before Opening Day, and we could still make roster moves.
And it’s not like we’ve dropped something like 25 million off the payroll since the end of the season.
Have a little patience. The 2009 team’s not done yet. Plus I think that the best case
scenario of a team rebuild is a long shot at best, so a somewhat flawed M’s team that goes from 62 wins to 82 wins without a good cleanup hitter should make us pretty damned happy.
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
I have no idea how Sean Green is going to survive in the city that never sleeps.
Slica - December 10, 2008
Go crazy, of course.
Benne - December 10, 2008
He'll make up for everyone else's lack of sleep.
Two Rs and Two Ls - December 10, 2008
But the hookers!
Slica - December 10, 2008
Didn't say he'd be sleeping alone, did I?
Two Rs and Two Ls - December 10, 2008
Bavasi brought us Sexson, Zduriencik in the same thought process would not make the same mistake.
Turdburglar - December 10, 2008
"We need a #3 and #4 hitter." is not a good thought process.
We just need a better overall team.
ThundaPC - December 10, 2008
Lopez might bat at one of those spots.
Then he can rack up stats thanks to Ichiro and get a 12 year contract with us. : D
Slica - December 10, 2008
Because he wouldn't think 'What we really need is a #3 or 4 hitter'
It’s a fundamentally unsound way of building a roster. Bavasi wasn’t bad at tactic moves, he was terrible at determined strategies, because his obsession with roles led him to conclude that we needed fat singles hitters for DH, etc.
Graham MacAree - December 10, 2008
Congrats.
I’m not used to this site having good moves of their own to discuss.
R.J. Anderson - December 10, 2008
I'm going out to get drunk and dance in the streets.
Benne - December 10, 2008
Yea, it's kind of odd.
Funny how I pondered what Rays fans talked about since they didn’t have to bitch about shitty management. I guess this is what its like.
Fin - December 10, 2008
DRB is dead to us now.
Teej - December 10, 2008
One move left to make.
Yuni for Joyce.
Wilder. - December 11, 2008
Too many outfielders!
.Taylor - December 11, 2008
Putz and Green were on the decline
This trade is a steal. Good job ripping off Franklin Gutiérrez from the ever declining Indians.
E5 - December 10, 2008
How in God's name was Green on the decline?
Graham MacAree - December 10, 2008
Maybe in the relief arms are short lived and unpredictable kind of decline way?
I dunno.
The Typical Idiot Fan - December 10, 2008
This is true.
I would laugh if his arm exploded on opening day next year.
Fin - December 10, 2008
I just have to say this.
Shit, GMZ is crafty. Its almost like I am in disbelief, I am so used to incompetence of Bavasi and Co.
Fin - December 10, 2008
It's amazing, but this is the first time I've really been excited about Seattle sports since Durant...
I’m sending Zduriencik a Christmas gift.
abender20 - December 10, 2008
How about....
1.Chavez LF
2. Gutierrez CF
3.Ichiro RF
4. Beltre 3B
5.Lopez 2B
6.Branyan 1B
7.Balentien DH
8.Clement C
9.Betancourt SS
I dunno, just throwin out ideas… It’s probably gonna be pretty ugly no matter how you slice it.
Turdburglar - December 10, 2008
It doesn't matter. It really doesn't.
Graham MacAree - December 10, 2008
You seem to think tomorrow is opening day.
Fortunately, it’s not. The roster’s not done yet.
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
This.
Patience young padawan.
The Typical Idiot Fan - December 10, 2008
Let Wakamatsu decide the lineup....
ThundaPC - December 10, 2008
How about this
Gutierrez CF
Ichiro RF
Beltre 3RD
Griffey DH
Lopez 2b
Branyan 1B
Clement C
Betancourt SS
Chavez LF
E5 - December 10, 2008
Roster's not set, doesn't matter
Griffey blows
JI - December 10, 2008
Griffey
Clearly is not the same as he was but he is still a quality major leaguer and would be a nice addition to a rebuilding M’s team. He would help the young guys on the team. Great guy
E5 - December 10, 2008
PROVEN VETERAN
Faux - December 10, 2008
Hey, let's sign Ken Griffey
Not Junior, Senior. Great guy, proven veteran, perfect guy to have in the clubhouse. I bet he could play LF or DH.
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
Hall of Fame talent
ThundaPC - December 10, 2008
Has pulse.
JLC - December 10, 2008
Let's sign Goose Gossage!
Clearly is not the same as he was but he is still a
quality major leaguerHall of Fame Talent and would be a nice addition to a rebuilding M’s team. He would help the young guys on the team. Great guyFaux - December 10, 2008
OUCH
My heart hurts.
E5 - December 10, 2008
We're not saying he wasn't good before.
We’re just saying he’s not a Major League player now.
http://www.lookoutlanding.com/2008/6/4/546195/three-guys-who-agree-on-ev
Read this. These numbers taken over time show the decline of a great player. It happens, nobody’s body will last forever, and he pushed it harder than most.
I loved Junior when he was here, but he’s a detriment to any team now. (Maybe not the Orioles/Royals/Marlins)
Faux - December 10, 2008
Also keep in mind that the condition of holding Wlad back in AAA is now not possible.
Faux - December 10, 2008
This:Accuracy
Griffey:!Worst everyday player in the majors
Graham MacAree - December 10, 2008
And on cue
BrianL - December 10, 2008
He'd only help the young guys by comparison.
Or by example, as in “How not to age gracefully.”
JLC - December 10, 2008
No, he's not. His defense is so bad as to make him a DH only player, and his bat is in serious decline overall
and cannot be used against LHP.
Matthew - December 10, 2008
Plus, we're likely playing a 1B and C platoon already.
Unless the AL is going to go to a 30 man roster, we’re going to run out of roster spots platooning guys.
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
Grffiey blocks young players
costs money
sucks at baseball
panders to the sad pathetic nostalgia demographic
Pass
JI - December 10, 2008
weaton4life?
.Taylor - December 11, 2008
Mariners are on the rise if they can keep making deals like this one.
E5 - December 10, 2008
I really
Like the direction of the new management in town. It would be awesome to see a winner back in Seattle after these many years of sub par play.
E5 - December 10, 2008
They need to bring
Griffey back now.
E5 - December 10, 2008
Are you trying to be annoying?
Graham MacAree - December 10, 2008
Fuck Griffey
JI - December 10, 2008
Dude
Robert - December 10, 2008
I know it's an unpopular position around here but fuck 'em
he left us to live in Cincinnati. That’s one of the biggest crapholes in all of America
JI - December 10, 2008
You know you wanna sing the Cincinnati Song.
Slica - December 10, 2008
Oh my god.
BrettJMiller - December 10, 2008
Shocking isn't it?
JI - December 10, 2008
What the hell happened to this thread?
I was only gone for five minutes.
BrianL - December 10, 2008
It seemed like no one had been giving anyone any reason for random Griffey hate for awhile, and then this past month the crazy "bring him back" talk started again.
BrettJMiller - December 10, 2008
IceStormV1 - December 10, 2008
that came out way too fucking big
IceStormV1 - December 10, 2008
But it works!
The Typical Idiot Fan - December 10, 2008
Never again
Dewey N - December 10, 2008
Make them stop
JLC - December 10, 2008
...annnnnnd adblocked
JI - December 10, 2008
Thing to be hidden,
this
JI - December 10, 2008
I like this one.
Robert - December 10, 2008
I'm glad I stumbled on this.
E5 is a troll that we kicked out of LGT. Yeah he’s just trying to fuck with you.
nickjs21 - December 14, 2008
So this is why Jeff is afraid of being good.
Aaron Campeau - December 10, 2008
burnt he tree
JI - December 10, 2008
needs more 1111!!11!!s
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
All I can really say is "Thanks JJ".
He really was the highlight of the 07 season. I went to many ballgames that year, and whenever he came out in the 9th, the whole place went on fire. Definitely striking out Bonds was my favorite moment— also one that I was thankfully there for.
He also gave me something else special- my favorite piece of baseball memorabilia. I was drunk one night, and talked to him through the bullpen fence. I admitted how much of a fan I was (well, I didn’t tell him about my man crush, but close enough), and I asked him if he would sign a ball for me. But not just any signature, I wanted something special… I wanted him to trace his split finger grip on the ball. He chuckled, smiled and agreed to do it. It was awesome.
So, JJ, thanks a lot. I hope you aren’t pissed we traded you.
batura - December 10, 2008
This is the shit
ConorGlassey - December 10, 2008
That's... pretty cool, actually.
Two Rs and Two Ls - December 10, 2008
Thanks
This is actually kinda choking me up a little. Not because I’m sad, but because it was just a cool moment. I’ll have to find the pic of him holding the grip while Oliveros did the tracing.
batura - December 10, 2008
Why do I see a penis?
What was he trying to do there? Did he just like… sneeze really bad when doing that or something?
The Typical Idiot Fan - December 10, 2008
Did you read it?
ConorGlassey - December 10, 2008
I think a Rorschach ink blot test may reveal something interesting.
JLC - December 10, 2008
No. That would help wouldn't it?
I still see penis, though.
The Typical Idiot Fan - December 10, 2008
You should meet Robert.
Slica - December 10, 2008
Maybe not so much?
Faux - December 10, 2008
sometimes a banana is just a banana
msb - December 10, 2008
Thats awesome!
Slica - December 10, 2008
More
batura - December 10, 2008
Best piece of memorabilia I've seen you lucky so and so! : )
dpseadv - December 10, 2008
That is awesome.
Goose - December 11, 2008
Sweet deal.
J.J. is going to be missed, but he’s taking one for the team.
Wilder. - December 11, 2008
fuck no more Tuesday with greeen
no more 2 faces and go crazy
tootthekazoo - December 10, 2008
How drunk are you right now?
BrianL - December 10, 2008
Apparently Very!
E5 - December 10, 2008
About as much as me, I presume.
kevin_ess - December 10, 2008
You drink too?
I was all excuted for a ll drunk party but everybody was in the jj place insted but i jsut found out
tootthekazoo - December 10, 2008
Yeah. I drink holy water.
By the case.
kevin_ess - December 10, 2008
quite because I didnt eat but just a hot pocket for lunch today
and had 6 blkue moons at bowling
tootthekazoo - December 10, 2008
Who's hot pocket did you have for lunch.
E5 - December 10, 2008
LOL!
Robert - December 10, 2008
i get it is that a sex joking
whatever
tootthekazoo - December 10, 2008
*whose's
tootthekazoo - December 10, 2008
Zduriencik on KJR right now
msb - December 10, 2008
Highlights?
BrianL - December 10, 2008
When I was a kid I enjoyed that magazine.
E5 - December 10, 2008
Goofus and Gallant were kind of cool.
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
He is doing this to improve OF defense.
It’s like the anti-Bavasi (cries)
“We might not be finished.”
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
Oh my God he actually recognizes the importance of defense.
Where the hell am I?
BrianL - December 10, 2008
I'm waiting for the Adam Dunn signing to bring us back to reality.
JLC - December 10, 2008
Why?
Enjoy this.
Aaron Campeau - December 10, 2008
I don't seriously think we'll sign Adam Dunn
In fact, a small part of me is starting to think that he’s becoming undervalued since teams are beginning to realize the importance of defense. I’m sure someone’s going to give him a 3-4 year contract, but what if teams are only willing to give him a 1 year deal? Very unlikely, but that’s when it gets interesting.
JLC - December 10, 2008
I know, I'm just excited to be excited and I think everyone else should be too.
Aaron Campeau - December 10, 2008
Trust me, I am very excited about this.
Even more than I’d be if it were Putz for Matt Joyce straight up.
I’m trying not to think about losing Valbuena, though.
JLC - December 10, 2008
I love listening to him talk about the minor leaguers
he actually mentions how playing in a specific league relates to a player’s numbers…
he still says they haven’t determined what will happen with Morrow— he wants the coaching staff to get their hands on him, and see the player.
they talked Fields this morning with Boras (among other topics)
-not negotiations, just pleasantriesmsb - December 10, 2008
Puckett brought up the other rumors
and Z says you talk about a lot of players, but that they were not involved with trades for Ankiel or Fielder
msb - December 10, 2008
wri9ong
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
It's going to be exciting seeing what else he can pull off.
A SS and maybe a big power hitter would be great.
BrettJMiller - December 10, 2008
And a pony.
Two Rs and Two Ls - December 10, 2008
Milton Bradley!
JI - December 10, 2008
Rocco Baldelli!
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
Despite the cost, I'd spend the money for Bradley
BrettJMiller - December 10, 2008
My problem with Bradley is simple:
I hate multi-year deals for guys who probably will miss 1/3rd of the playing time during the deal.
It’s one thing for J.D. Drew to do a deal with the Red Sox, but J.D. Drew is like Cal Ripken compared to Milton Bradley. If he gets a 3 year deal, we’d be doing well if he played 300-330 out of 486 games. That’s pretty bad.
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
He's psyched about Carrera and Cleto
Said impressed with Carerra’s extra base power, and FSL is not an easy league to hit in.
(.705 league OPS, BTW)
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
And Cleto hits 98, apparently.
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
He called Jeff Clement *Matt*
Which confused me at first – I wasn’t paying much attention and had to rewind to verify that he slipped up. For a second there I thought we’d picked up Matt Clement as well.
sooper jeenyus - December 11, 2008
I was listening online and the feed died before he came on...
JMKaustin - December 10, 2008
He actually gets it
This isn’t a mistake. WE DID GOOD WITHOUT A MISTAKE
Robert - December 10, 2008
You mean...
We’re at the top-right corner of DePo’s chart?
BrianL - December 10, 2008
EVEN BETTER TOP LEFT CORNER!
(God I’m specially challenged)
BrianL - December 10, 2008
specially?
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
God dammit.
BrianL - December 10, 2008
'specially
It’s a contraction.
Faux - December 10, 2008
No, I JI'd that word.
BrianL - December 10, 2008
This comment deserves a gold star.
JLC - December 10, 2008
Please let Tuesdays with Sean Green continue
That’s all I’m going to say.
Kouvre - December 10, 2008
KJR internet is dead
JI - December 10, 2008
Hey all
Mets fan here. Just wondering what your perspectives are on what we got back. I’ve been wanting Putz since the second I found out he might be on the market, but I was curious if you all think he can bounce back to ‘06-’07 levels. And I know pretty much nothing about Reed or Green, so any insight would be helpful.
My take on what you guys got from us:
Chavez – one of the best defensive outfielders I’ve ever seen. His catch in the 2006 NLCS was without a doubt the high point of the post-Piazza Mets, and probably the 3rd best Mets-moment of my lifetime. In ‘06 he was a jack-of-all trades, filling in at every outfield spot and giving us more than enough offense to go with his defense (101 OPS+ and GG caliber defense ftw). In ’07 his offense regressed a bit, and then last year pretty much fell off a cliff, and he was pretty marginalized once Fernando Tatis started hitting and Dan Murphy came up. Seeing him pinch hit for the pitcher and then not even play the field the next inning was infuriating. I’m happy to see him freed to a team where he can roam the outfield a lot more than we gave him the chance to.
Heilman – while Chavez gave us the high point of 2006, Heilman might have given us the low point, with the home run he gave up off to Yadier Molina. I’m not a particularly big fan of Heilman, due to his constant whining about wanting to start and the fact that he cost us the chance at the World Series, then was unreliable down the stretch in ‘07 and absolutely awful last year. That said, he’s undeniably talented, and I’ve been saying for months that I think he’ll bounce back next year as long as he’s no longer pitching in NY. I would expect a mid 3’s ERA, about a strikeout an inning, and a WHIP around 1.10-1.20.
cjmulrain - December 10, 2008
JJ and Green
Are on the Decline and Reed is a nice fill in bench player.
E5 - December 10, 2008
How is Green on the decline?
JI - December 10, 2008
Zuh
Graham MacAree - December 10, 2008
How are JJ and Green on the decline?
BrettJMiller - December 10, 2008
What's the Decline and how do I get on it?
JLC - December 10, 2008
Awesome NOFX EP!
ConorGlassey - December 10, 2008
Provide evidence of this.
Matthew - December 10, 2008
But repetition makes things right
Graham MacAree - December 10, 2008
There's also the fact that repetition makes things right.
eponymous_coward - December 10, 2008
Provide evidence of this.
Slica - December 10, 2008
Works out for both sides
Putz is a good gamble because of his contract, Gren and Reed have their uses, and Carp is the only player the Mets are going to miss.
JI - December 10, 2008
JJ's a gamble. If his ineffectiveness last year was just costocondritis and he recovers, great
He’s one of the top relievers in baseball. If not, you’re paying $6M for a broken-down former closer.
Green is an effective reliever with an absurd GB%. Lefties tend to torch him and he’ll have some bad streaks here and there, but he’s been a really effective player over the past couple of years.
Reed is our version of Endy Chavez, I guess. Maybe a little bit worse. Nothing particularly exciting unless he can somehow learn to hit.
Graham MacAree - December 10, 2008
Two names: Castillo and Delgado.
He better hope he can get the righties out in front of his pitches.
Faux - December 10, 2008
Reed
Great minor league hitter for average (close to .400, was once a top 50 type prospect), hasn’t translated to the majors. Pretty good defensive OF, but inexplicably just has no clue how to steal bases, even though he would seem to have the speed to do it. Can’t hit lefties, is OK versus righties. Not much power.
He needs a change of scenery. When he came over in the Freddy Garcia deal, everyone expected him to be the CF of the future. Didn’t pan out, but he could still turn out to be useful. Learning to steal bases would really add to his value – he could be a fourth OF, pinch runner, platoon player in the NL. Wouldn’t surprise me to see him be a valuable role player in NY.
saltydog75 - December 10, 2008
nice
Sounds like this is the rare deal that works out for both sides (except Cleveland, I don't really get their role in this)cjmulrain - December 10, 2008
Cleveland got a couple of useful players for spare parts (for them)
Graham MacAree - December 10, 2008
I'll miss you JJ.
You were always great for a laugh:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tVGb28uVjio
The Typical Idiot Fan - December 10, 2008
Woah, did I get banned?
Where did my comments go?
CapSea - December 10, 2008
I'm guessing a few subthreads were hidden
None of them started by you.
Jeff Sullivan - December 10, 2008
Trying to keep the threads clean
Matthew - December 10, 2008
First Thought Was
We gave up a lot to give up a lot. My second thought is that I really really really like Gutierrez. His defense is well publicized and while he will never walk the world his bat has some serious upside in a Torri Hunter way. He was better at 24 then Hunter was although he did regress this year obviously.
I have no interest in Chavez I think his bat is miserable and his defense is overated although admittedly PMR and UZR both disagree with me. The Mets inevetiably sold low on Heilman
Minus the other prospects which I don’t know much about I like the deal for the Indian a lot and the Mets kind of. The Indians are very good at talent acquisition and Gutierrez was very expendable because of Ben Franisco and one of them had to go. Joe Smith is an excellent ROOGY and Valbuena is a decent prospect.
For the Mets I consider Reed and Endy to be a straight sawp with defense for a little upside and youth. Joe Smith for Sean Green a straight swap (albiet the M’s selling low on Sean Green) leaving the deal as Mike Carp and Aaron Heilman for JJ. They sold low on Heilman and Carp isn’t a second tier 1st baseman (1% John Olerud 15% Lyle Overbay) but at the same time they got a lot of value in shoring up their weakest point
Trenchtown - December 10, 2008
Jesus what a buizare nuight
I go get piss durnk and bowling and vome home to see tha jj is gone. tToo bad because i like him and Greeen but we are beter now
tootthekazoo - December 10, 2008
Doesn't it seem like we are a far cry from these days?
Fin - December 10, 2008
Sorry, that was way too big.
Fin - December 10, 2008
Something like that probably has to big.
In which case, a link is probably best.
Teej - December 10, 2008
Yea, I think I did it in like mid-2007
Took me a long time to photoshop because I had to shop out all the japanese words that were surrounding the text bubbles.
Fin - December 10, 2008
has to BE big
Teej - December 10, 2008
You know, I could've made this gold if I had made in 2008.
O well, it’s still pretty funny.
Fin - December 10, 2008
Funny
JMKaustin - December 10, 2008
I'm listening to
nobody Putz JJ in the corner as we speak in rememberance of his time as an M
Trenchtown - December 10, 2008
Fuck it. I'll bat DH.
kevin_ess - December 10, 2008
Can you bat 4th?
Two Rs and Two Ls - December 10, 2008
My bad. I did that without thinking. That was not necessary.
Two Rs and Two Ls - December 10, 2008
He;s gritty and will di what needed to win
tootthekazoo - December 10, 2008
This is true. And I'm a Washington native willing to sleep with Rick Rizzs for the right amount of attention.
I warn you, though. I only speak Japanese to the press. I know, it’s a dichotomy.
kevin_ess - December 10, 2008
4rd
Faux - December 10, 2008
In that case I will take 3nd.
Fin - December 10, 2008
I will 1th
tootthekazoo - December 10, 2008
oh shit I missed reply
tootthekazoo - December 10, 2008
Your mother is disappointed.
kevin_ess - December 10, 2008
She has biger problems
tootthekazoo - December 10, 2008
You're not pregnant again, are you??
kevin_ess - December 10, 2008
I'm a boy and can't nbe pregnat
Silly dude
tootthekazoo - December 10, 2008
At first I liked this deal
but thinking about it more I’m not sure. I feel like for the players we gave up, we could have probably gotten guys with higher ceilings. Individually they are nice players but the trade really isn’t impressing me. Not a bad deal but more of a meh.
I do like the methodology behind the trade. Its nice to see thinking which is not severely flawed coming from our FO.
Edgar for Pres - December 11, 2008
I think we have to keep in mind..
If NY never sees 07 JJ again this becomes quite the haul for the Ms. I’m not saying we should evaluate any trade based on its results, but JJ is an unknown at this point.
CKel - December 11, 2008
I'll put everything I own on JJ never seeing 2007 again.
That year was absolutely insane.
Teej - December 11, 2008
And 2006 was even better!
Jeff Sullivan - December 11, 2008
I'd put a lot of money on JJ never having access to time travel, yes.
Graham MacAree - December 12, 2008
I'll take this bet
seattlebruin - December 14, 2008
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