The money is unknown at this point, but it's a one year, incentive-laden contract. Link. Another link. MLB.com link.
Update: Jim Street reports $2M in base salary with more in incentives based on appearances and attendance. The wording is poor, so I can't figure out whether the incentives are worth $2M or $4M total.
We've been talking about this nonstop for the better part of a week now, so all I have to say is this:
Welcome back, Junior. You were missed.
0 recs | 298 comments
Hells yeah!
Batting 4th, number 24… Ken GRIFFEEEEEEEEEEEEY JUNIOR!
Wilder. - February 18, 2009
Finally, the protection Ibanez needs.
O wait.
Fin - February 18, 2009
Late
Fuzz - February 18, 2009
haha.
walkoffwalk - February 18, 2009
And I'm glad that little saga is finally over
Graham MacAree - February 18, 2009
Thank you
If the Braves got a Diaz-Junior platoon they might have eked out a few more wins.
future - February 18, 2009
*losses
Mariner John - February 19, 2009
Well, that circus is over.
Time for a whole new wave of circus!
Matthew - February 18, 2009
Maybe we could bring back A-Rod, too.
andrewgolfsalot - February 18, 2009
The Yankees did want a trade for Washburn last year.
mark sobba - February 18, 2009
How about this one?
Graham MacAree - February 18, 2009
I meant the media hamming it up with Jr during ST and the season.
This was the rain shower. Prepare for the hurricane.
Matthew - February 18, 2009
I plan on avoiding all major Seattle media outlets the week before the home opener.
pdb - February 18, 2009
?
Graham MacAree - February 18, 2009
Tuesday.
Matthew - February 18, 2009
Most useless day of the week
Fuzz - February 18, 2009
Canucks tommorow!
Woodinville_12thMan - February 18, 2009
And somewhere
Dave “Softy” Mahler weeps tears of joy.
BrianL - February 18, 2009
All over his pile of Little Debbie Snack Cakes.
kevin_ess - February 18, 2009
Frank Wren is going to release a statement tomorrow threatening to never work with Griffey's agent ever again.
esoteric - February 18, 2009
This is my favorite part of the saga.
hcoguy - February 18, 2009
Thank gawd it's over.
Or at least this round of hoopla. It will now continue its second stage of life well into May.
Big Jared - February 18, 2009
To be honest, it's been well discussed how little this actually mean in term of wins and losses..
but I think it’s pretty damn cool, that he turned down a chance to play close to home and LF… to come back to Seattle and finish up
Rudy4three - February 18, 2009
Funny thing is, that really does say something, doesn't it?
esoteric - February 18, 2009
I'd rather not see him in LF regularly.
BrianL - February 18, 2009
He's not disagreeing with you.
Faux - February 18, 2009
Whoops I misread that.
BrianL - February 18, 2009
GOD I WISH HE'D MAKE A DAMN DECISION ALREADY
oh, sorry. Reflex.
pdb - February 18, 2009
Boy the Atlanta Journal Constitution looks pretty stupid right now
OlSalty - February 18, 2009
When don't they though?
They are about as dumb as you can get in the journalism world. I have an ex-girlfriend attending U. Florida and she had an internship offer there over the summer and she turned it down to go back and work for a smaller newspaper.
Fuzz - February 18, 2009
any more/less so than the Seattle papers when it was a done deal last week?
we are dealing with Jr here, after all.
msb - February 18, 2009
Umm
Is there a link to this story? After all, this was supposedly a “done” deal last weekend.
Tekboy - February 18, 2009
There's a link in the first line of the post.
Graham MacAree - February 18, 2009
Sorry
I will attempt to be more observant in the future.
Thanks.
Tekboy - February 18, 2009
Interesting Side Note...
The Seattle Times got scooped by a paper that is, in all likelihood, going out of business. Goodness.
Doug Taylor - February 18, 2009
Well this was all first reported by Atlanta television.
The PI article was clearly a hastily-retooled “How Griffey Got Away” postmortem that had to be adjusted in light of the happy ending.
esoteric - February 18, 2009
The Times is going out of business soon enough.
Aaron Campeau - February 19, 2009
I can't help
but be really happy right now.
Maybe this is a bad decision for us… but its probably the best bad decision our team has made in a very long time.
zeeehjee - February 18, 2009
What, Sexson wasn't a thrill?
Fearless Frog - February 18, 2009
Am I the only one who still feels mostly indifferent?
BrianL - February 18, 2009
Me too.
I was not a fan back in the 90s, so I have no emotional attachment and am just really hoping he is okay with the part-time DH role. If there is drama then I will be pissed. It will be cool if I get to see him hit a HR in person though…I usually go to about 16 games/season so it’s possible. Actually this year I will probably go to more since I bought 10 games in a good seat at season ticket prices and will probably hit several more games with cheaper seats.
appleshampoo - February 18, 2009
No. I barely care.
royalcurve - February 18, 2009
I'm only interested in how well he will (or will not) hit.
ignacio - February 18, 2009
WOOOO!!!
brayden04 - February 18, 2009
He can always sign with the Braves next year.
csiems - February 18, 2009
He has played 2 innings at 1B.
Big Jared - February 18, 2009
Are you suggesting that he plays 1B?
That would be as effective as Ibanez playing 3rd
Fuzz - February 18, 2009
I didn't want it to happen, but now that it's over and there's no point in arguing about it, I feel oddly happy.
Welcome back, Junior.
Teej - February 18, 2009
And please retire after this season.
Teej - February 18, 2009
I don't even want to think about that possibility.
BrianL - February 18, 2009
What if he has a really good season?
Fearless Frog - February 18, 2009
He can go play for someone else.
BrianL - February 18, 2009
That's the thing, though.
80 percent of the smile on my face is rooted in the idea of Griffey playing his last game in a Mariners uniform. If he leaves and goes somewhere else, it makes things a lot less awesome. In my irrational opinion.
Teej - February 18, 2009
If he has a good season he's coming back.
JI - February 18, 2009
this seasonOpening DayGraham MacAree - February 18, 2009
I feel your fear
Since there is no good choice left, I’m just going to go with irrational optimism……….
Last year was just the knee.
DHing will save his legs for hitting.
Coming ‘home’ will magically roll back the odometer 10 years.
Feed him a steady diet of righties and he’ll hit pretty well.
etc. etc. et al
Pushing all rational concerns of injury/age/sucking aside.
There are many stages of Griffey thought and I’ve reached the resignation stage.
I just hope he stays healthy and reasonably productive.
Big Jared - February 18, 2009
This has to happen
Corco - February 18, 2009
So Hickey says the deal is expected to have incentives based on attendance.
Teej - February 18, 2009
Is that legal?
Seems odd, especially since depending how much the incentive was, he could purchase a bunch of cheap seats to help pad the numbers and get the extra money.
hcoguy - February 18, 2009
Probably something along the lines of 2% of revenue over last season's average attendance.
Not including Opening Day and holidays.
In other words, if the average attendance was 18,000, anything above that number Griffey would receive 2% of the revenue. This is the way I would have drawn it up.
Wilder. - February 18, 2009
Ok that makes sense
hcoguy - February 18, 2009
...Seriously?
BrianL - February 18, 2009
I figured Goldberg would want something like this.
Wilder. - February 18, 2009
Shocker
Fuzz - February 18, 2009
I heard Mark Mcgwire had something like this after the season he hit 70 HRs.
Like a dollar from every ticket sold or something.
But I could be miss-remembering.
mark sobba - February 18, 2009
I'm going to pretend that this is a reply to Fuzz's shocker graphic.
kevin_ess - February 18, 2009
Jim Street's also saying that there are attendance-based incentives.
Teej - February 18, 2009
I Was At His First Game Back With The Reds...
1) His batting practice performance was just nuts…he was really into it.
2) The ceremony was incredible.
3) Most Griffey fans at that game were absolutely obnoxious, booing their own team just because Griffey was back. They booed in his first at-bat, because Feierabend was throwing to first. They thought Feier was ducking him, completely oblivious to the fact that Brandon Phillips, known base stealer was on first. It was infuriating.
Doug Taylor - February 18, 2009
Well #3 will be a positive now.
Wilder. - February 18, 2009
I still blame that moment on breaking Feierabend
After that start he was never the same
Corco - February 18, 2009
I blame his mediocre stuff
Sportszilla - February 18, 2009
Not to mention that the pickoff is a pretty big part of Feierabend's game.
Teej - February 18, 2009
Sorry.
GTE.
Double06 - February 18, 2009
well this made s ucky day awesome
Corco - February 18, 2009
If you're drunk, please don't post. Go frolic about and have fun instead.
If you’re not, please write like a normal person.
Graham MacAree - February 18, 2009
Well this made a sucky day awesome
Sorry I was just excited
Corco - February 18, 2009
I'm go gonna frolic my frown upside down.
Sec 108 - February 18, 2009
Why not just stand upright and smile?
Am I the only sane one here?
kevin_ess - February 18, 2009
Maybe? I do not assume I am sane.
Sec 108 - February 18, 2009
That was a joke - considering it's from me.
kevin_ess - February 18, 2009
I stand by my assertion regarding my mental stability.
Sec 108 - February 18, 2009
Listen - you're a friend of mine. I think everyone knows you're crazier than a shithouse rat.
kevin_ess - February 18, 2009
Pics of Corco frolicing about, please
This movie isn’t that good. So why am I smiling?
Garces - February 18, 2009
Does he frolic or gambol?
msb - February 18, 2009
Over/under Griffey demands a trade by July 1st.
He will want to retire close to home.
mark sobba - February 18, 2009
Geoff Baker Live! Special
Go ask questions!
Wilder. - February 18, 2009
It's official:
MLB.com
Graham MacAree - February 18, 2009
MLB.com also said matter of factly we had completed the trade for Omar Vizquel
This isn’t over until the fat lady sings
Corco - February 18, 2009
Generally contract terms aren't released until something's been signed
Graham MacAree - February 18, 2009
I see that now
Holy buckets that’s too much in terms of incentives
Corco - February 18, 2009
I can't work out whether he means $2M of incentives or $4M.
Street is bad at writing
Graham MacAree - February 18, 2009
Ditto.
Matthew - February 18, 2009
I'm pretty sure it's $4M in incentives
it sure would be nice to see a breakdown of it.
seattlebruin - February 18, 2009
That's how I read it, too, but it is ambigious.
Teej - February 18, 2009
Either way, the Mariners know enough about what they're doing to recoup the attendance-based money
Graham MacAree - February 18, 2009
This.
kevin_ess - February 18, 2009
Yeah, I'm not worried.
If he ends up being a half-win to one-win player who earns $5 or $6 million, whatever. The ticket sales should make up for that.
Teej - February 18, 2009
Not like we were going to spend the money on Manny.
kevin_ess - February 18, 2009
I read it as $4 Million
Corco - February 18, 2009
Incentives = Griffey playing well
if he plays well, then he’ll have earned the incentives in terms of value added to the team. I like it.
seattlebruin - February 18, 2009
Incentives are almost always based on plate appearances
Given that this is Griffey odds are he’s going to get most of them
Corco - February 18, 2009
Just like how Jose Vidro's option vested last season.
Matthew - February 18, 2009
If we're out of contention he is far less releaseable than Vidro
Corco - February 18, 2009
I heard a funny comment about ARod today:
Officials are scrambling to investigate why steroids don’t seem to work in October…
kevin_ess - February 18, 2009
And M's fans should be PISSED
A-Rod didn’t care enough about them to use ’roids while in Seattle…
PositivePaul - February 19, 2009
If he sucks and we're out of contention, big deal if he gets more PAs
if he sucks and we’re in contention, they’ll bench him (this isn’t going to happen).
If he’s good and we’re in contention then sweet Jesus will I be happy.
seattlebruin - February 18, 2009
This is the happiest I've been in quite some time
Please excuse me while I go find some Mariners tickets to buy
seattlebruin - February 18, 2009
I can't wait for him to tear something during the 2 week long opening roadtrip
Robert - February 18, 2009
ACL, MCL, PCL, and LCL
Only 4 different ligaments in the knee that could potentially go bad!!!
Fuzz - February 18, 2009
2 knees, as well.
Not to mention there are always the muscles that connect to those knees that would go bad from compensation.
Faux - February 18, 2009
Well....considering the muscles don't directly connect to the knees
They use those ligaments to keep themselves together.
Ligament=muscle to bone
Tendon=bone to bone
I think cartilage is the word you were looking for. I’ve done enough damage to my left knee that this is all back stored knowledge now
Fuzz - February 18, 2009
Replace "knees" with "ligaments" in there.
Faux - February 18, 2009
Sorry, didn't mean to jump all over you there
Fuzz - February 18, 2009
It's all good.
Kids, don’t comment while working!
Faux - February 18, 2009
That's a pretty pendantic argument
Graham MacAree - February 18, 2009
Use less syllables Graham
You know I don’t speak intelligent person
Fuzz - February 18, 2009
Don't be so picky in your words
Graham MacAree - February 18, 2009
I'd like to think this is intentional.
(Is the “in” an English thing?)
Also, your’re.
Faux - February 18, 2009
I don't leave my comfort zone
It’s scary out there
Fuzz - February 18, 2009
Provided he doesn't prevent us from reaching the post season
This is great. I’m excited. I watched him suck it up as a red, so watching him suck as a Mariner is A-Okay with me.
CapSea - February 18, 2009
I'm new relatively new here.
Is the general consensus that we have an outside shot at the postseason?
Fearless Frog - February 18, 2009
Small chance.
We’re looking at a team that should be projected to win around 75 games. But with a few breakouts (Clement, Gutierrez, perhaps even Wlad) and some good luck, we could push that to 85, which just might be enough to top a shitty division.
Teej - February 18, 2009
We have no idea what to expect with Z before the trade deadline before the All Star game. It could get interesting.
kevin_ess - February 18, 2009
I was happy when it looked like he was heading to Atlanta.
Now I’m happy that it looks like he’s heading here.
….
I’m so confused.
ThundaPC - February 18, 2009
Junior is apparently the font of happiness in your life
Graham MacAree - February 18, 2009
I'll have to put that to the test.
ThundaPC - February 18, 2009
Gas on KJR just suggested that the DH can allow Junior to play for another two or three years.
BrianL - February 18, 2009
If he hits I'm fine with that.
I just worry that won’t be the case. I want to be optimistic so I’ll say he’s never been a DH. We shall see.
Big Jared - February 18, 2009
The gods say Girffey in ATL = 75 HRs, Griffey in SEA = 12.
kevin_ess - February 18, 2009
Who is Girffey?
Is that the Toys R Us Giraffe?
Fuzz - February 18, 2009
I have a huge bandage on my finger. Sorry.
kevin_ess - February 18, 2009
I'm a little more assholish than usual today.
I didn’t have a chance to get into Robert and I’s daily yelling session because he got to work and disappeared
Fuzz - February 18, 2009
Spank him in the backroom for me.
kevin_ess - February 18, 2009
He might enjoy that?
Fuzz - February 18, 2009
Good point.
Spank him in the backroom for me.
kevin_ess - February 18, 2009
For me, too.
royalcurve - February 18, 2009
Now you're confusing me as to if this is a good thing or not
Is this punishment for him or pleasure for you guys?
Fuzz - February 18, 2009
Both.
kevin_ess - February 18, 2009
I need a adult
Robert - February 18, 2009
I cherish you.
royalcurve - February 18, 2009
A Zooperstars character.
krb - February 18, 2009
This reminds me of one of Jeff's all-time great posts
esoteric - February 18, 2009
Apparently there's an Ichiroach Suzuki now
Sorry I know the picture is horrible
OlSalty - February 18, 2009
That. Is terrible.
royalcurve - February 18, 2009
I'm sure it's every player's dream to be anthropomorphized into a giant cockroach
esoteric - February 18, 2009
Call it the Gregor Samsa Special.
esoteric - February 18, 2009
I looked around for the Ken Giraffey Junior gif but couldn't find it.
::shrugs::
Omerta - February 18, 2009
?
Jeff Sullivan - February 18, 2009
I was hoping for the photoshop of Griffey morphing into an animal
but beggars can’t be choosers.
Omerta - February 18, 2009
I know of no such .gif and like it that way
Jeff Sullivan - February 18, 2009
Oh I've seen in posted on here.
Damnit now I have to look again
(unless the above was a request not to).
Omerta - February 18, 2009
Er nevermind.
If you can’t find it here I never will.
Omerta - February 18, 2009
Robert!
Jeff Sullivan - February 18, 2009
Slama Damna Ding Dong!
Robert - February 18, 2009
AHAHAHA!
Excellent…
Omerta - February 18, 2009
Jesus Christ, that's disturbing.
kevin_ess - February 18, 2009
That's because Robert made it.
Back when he was JFOJL.
Faux - February 18, 2009
This is why I hate and love Robert.
kevin_ess - February 18, 2009
While I am not proud of my past
I understand that its made me the mod that I am today.
Robert - February 18, 2009
By mod you mean hipster.
kevin_ess - February 18, 2009
No by Mod I mean Mod
Robert - February 18, 2009
So, like a modified human being?
kevin_ess - February 18, 2009
My stars!
royalcurve - February 18, 2009
I would just like to say, that was an amazing thread.
oc - February 18, 2009
I had forgotten about these.
Thanks.
krb - February 18, 2009
I'm like the Sexy People's more retarded and memoriffic half.
Robert - February 18, 2009
You shine on your own, Robert.
You shine on your own.
royalcurve - February 18, 2009
Let's not forget that fielders moving to DH generally lose half a win of batting value over 600PA
Graham MacAree - February 18, 2009
Shhhhhhhhhhhh
I know this is why pinch hitting is so hard. Many guys don’t ever really adjust to the DH thing.
His seeing 600 PA would be either a really good or really, really bad sign.
Big Jared - February 18, 2009
At least nobody has unrealistic expectations of present day Griffey.
R.J. Anderson - February 18, 2009
Tch-yah.
msb - February 18, 2009
Gas also chided the local media and those darned blogs for hyping the story last week
and then promptly threw the phones open for callers to respond to the news that Griffey maybe said he was picking Seattle
msb - February 18, 2009
I have a soft spot for Gas, but don't always get where he's coming from.
kevin_ess - February 18, 2009
That's funny
Because Gas also has a lot of soft spots.
Actually, I like him too
Sportszilla - February 18, 2009
As long as Junior doesn't start griping about how Ichiro plays the game
I’ll be happy enough.
royalcurve - February 18, 2009
Ichi loves Griffey from all that I've heard
Robert - February 18, 2009
Love, American League Style
kevin_ess - February 18, 2009
You mean this video?
In case you have not seen it before.
22 yr old Ichiro meeting young Griffey!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ppb0libuNVw&feature=related
mark sobba - February 18, 2009
This is awesome!
I never seen/heard about this encounter. I love the Mr. Baseball music around the 5-minute point.
Wilder. - February 18, 2009
Thanks for putting this up, it's pretty awesome.
royalcurve - February 18, 2009
Even in Japanese, it makes sense.
Glad people like it.
mark sobba - February 18, 2009
Ichiro is as giddy as a goddamn school girl.
Double06 - February 18, 2009
Youtube has another part to this were he meets Jordan. He is so shy he can't look MJ in the face. It is great.
mark sobba - February 18, 2009
If he craned his neck enough he might be able to see some semblance of his elbow.
Double06 - February 18, 2009
Holy Crap.
He is so young that doesn’t even look like Ichiro. Also the lack of facial hair throws one off.
appleshampoo - February 19, 2009
O MY GOOOOOOOODNESSS!!!!
This is On Beyond AWESOME!!!!
PositivePaul - February 19, 2009
Has Ichi ever been on the DL?
Big Jared - February 18, 2009
No.
mark sobba - February 18, 2009
Didn't think so!
Big Jared - February 18, 2009
He done been on da down low many time.
kevin_ess - February 18, 2009
I don't give a fuck about contention
I’m making a trip to Safeco.
John Morgan - February 18, 2009
At this point I don't even care about the baseball ramifications.
I’m just going to be giddy as a schoolboy for a few days.
thewyrm - February 18, 2009
So does LaHair finally get bumped from the 40 man now?
Corco - February 18, 2009
This move has been coming for a while.
Though, in typical Mariner fashion, they were LaHair late in making it.
Phil Hatzenbuehler - February 19, 2009
Has this actually been confirmed by Griffey yet?
I’m holding off on feelings until then.
krb - February 18, 2009
Not gonna lie, I'm incredibly happy to have one more chance to see Junior in a Mariner uniform
Nick S - February 18, 2009
I'm nearly as happy not to have to see Garret Fucking Anderson in a Mariner uniform
Nick S - February 18, 2009
Just wait until ARod's reunion signing when he turns 42 at the end of his NYY contract.
Faux - February 18, 2009
You shut your dirty mouth.
royalcurve - February 18, 2009
They'll never take ARod back.
They’re too busy waiting for Aurilia to return.
kevin_ess - February 18, 2009
Rich Aurilia will always be a Mariner in my heart
He got a bum rap here
Corco - February 18, 2009
This
Corco - February 18, 2009
Oh screw it
I need to find tickets to the first home game in the worst way now.
BrianL - February 18, 2009
I have to do that anyway. I waited in line for 6 hours last year when tickets went on sale...
This year I will do it internet style. But by hook or by crook, I’m going to Opening Day.
royalcurve - February 18, 2009
Huh, now I have to pay attention to the opposing pitcher, LH or RH starter?
Kermit. - February 18, 2009
LL meetup?
I’m planning on going if I can get tickets.
Phil Hatzenbuehler - February 19, 2009
I might murder my parents so they wont be in Denver during the home opener so that I can go to Seattle
Corco - February 18, 2009
I'm screenshotting this.
kevin_ess - February 18, 2009
You can become the third Menendez brother!
Wilder. - February 18, 2009
Never mind
MY FATHER SOMEHOW UNDERSTANDS THE VALUE OF OUTFIELD DEFENSE THIS IS INCREDIBLE
Hi David,
I see on the ESPN website that Griffey will be signing a one-year contract with the Mariners, over Atlanta. Should fill some seats early in the season. I hope he gets 20 HR and 75 RBIs and plays very little outfield.
Love Dad
Corco - February 18, 2009
One less reason to murder your parents, I guess.
Teej - February 18, 2009
Oh shit now Kreuger is on KJR to talk Griffey.
BrianL - February 18, 2009
I wonder how rapey he looks interviewing KGJ?
Faux - February 18, 2009
Can't lie: emotionally this move feels pretty cool.
esoteric - February 18, 2009
By the way, I would really, really, really like someone to photoshop that old "Dewey Defeats Truman" photograph with the headline "Griffey Signs With Atlanta" substituted in.
esoteric - February 18, 2009
I would love to see this.
BrianL - February 18, 2009
Vatinus baiting.
Teej - February 18, 2009
Jeff Sullivan - February 18, 2009
Armando Benitez is a rare former Mariner that does not hold a place in my heart
Corco - February 18, 2009
Short notice but...
Big Jared - February 18, 2009
Shouldn't that be "Griffey signs with Atlanta"?
BrianL - February 18, 2009
Hahahaha
Now we have both! He could still change his mind.
Big Jared - February 18, 2009
Wow the fans at Talking Chop are pissed
Scrupio - February 18, 2009
And the funny thing is they really should be happy.
Even in all my nostalgia I would be mortified if we were bringing Griffey in to play the field.
Omerta - February 18, 2009
I don't think they're paying attention
I’m not into the in-depth numbers most of you use, but I can even seen when something is broken. I don’t think duct tape can fix this one
Fuzz - February 18, 2009
Chuck Armstrong is on with KJR right now.
BrianL - February 18, 2009
Z was just on KING 5. He seems happy.
I have to admit, I am too.
kevin_ess - February 18, 2009
Huh.
Chuck claims that Willie Mays helped talk Junior into returning to Seattle.
BrianL - February 18, 2009
Where there's a will, there's a Mays.
kevin_ess - February 18, 2009
the weird part of the story
is that it was Mays who wanted to talk to Griffey, and not Armstrong siccing Mays onto Ken.
msb - February 18, 2009
That's pretty frickin' cool, if you ask me.
kevin_ess - February 18, 2009
I must admit, the stalling took some of the shine off of the signing for me...
…but I have a feeling I’ll forget about it by opening day. Welcome back, “Kid.”
Omerta - February 18, 2009
Sounds like we need to turn back the clock on opening day with those horrible teal uniforms.
kevin_ess - February 18, 2009
I loved those uniforms.
BrianL - February 18, 2009
Replace the teal with yellow, and you've got a deal.
kevin_ess - February 18, 2009
This.
They were ugly as sin but they’re my favorite of all time.
Double06 - February 18, 2009
Good lord, no. Give me the Trident, and get the hell off of my lawn.
kevin_ess - February 18, 2009
For some reason this makes me really happy.
JI - February 18, 2009
And nothing is even on fire. Good for you!
kevin_ess - February 18, 2009
It's funny that
after all of the self-searching I had to do after I admitted to being against a Griffey acquisition, I would be lying through my teeth if I said I wasn’t excited to see Griffey back. I’m sure once he get’s injured playing LF and/or plays a lot against rhp my excitement will level off, but right now I’m happy.
Concerning tickets, this was the deciding factor in whether or not I was buying tickets for opening day. I’ll definitely be there. Can’t wait to hear him announced over the loudspeaker.
Zwakamatsu - February 18, 2009
Durrr
or against LHP. I would love to see him play a lot against RHP.
Zwakamatsu - February 18, 2009
A guy called in earlier to KJR and said,
“I am a father of three children. If Griffey is signed, I will go to three games this season. If they don’t sign him, I’ll never attend another Mariners game.”
Dear sir,
I heard your call to KJR this evening. Please do those of the rest of us here a favor, and teach your children to never, ever blog. If you blog yourself, please stop.
kevin_ess - February 18, 2009
So Griffey's going to hit third, right?
JI - February 18, 2009
11th. Behind Yuni.
kevin_ess - February 18, 2009
I meant to type 12th, but my bandage finger thwarted me.
kevin_ess - February 18, 2009
Said bandage is giving a lot of trouble tonight
Fuzz - February 18, 2009
I'm getting error messages left and right from SBN tonight...
Anyway, yes – you seem to be in a bad mood. Sorry.
kevin_ess - February 18, 2009
Against righties, I'm cool with that.
Teej - February 18, 2009
!
Ichiro
Cedeno
Griffey
Beltre
Branyan
Lopez
Clement
Guiterrez
Chavez
JI - February 18, 2009
Move Loafie to #2 and hit Cedeno eighth
seattlebruin - February 19, 2009
Lopez is horrible at getting on base
JI - February 19, 2009
He's at .323 from the 2-spot
and for whatever reason, he hits the best when he hits #2 (or maybe #5) and his numbers drop precipitously at the back of the order. Now a lot of this is probably the result of him hitting 2nd during his good 2008 and good 2006 first half, but without being able to clearly separate cause and effect, I’m loathe to move him out of the two-spot.
Cedeno’s career OBP is .289 anyway.
seattlebruin - February 19, 2009
.328 last year
seattlebruin - February 19, 2009
Yeah but Cedeno has a much higher on-base ceiling
He could be league average if he plays up to his potential. Lopez would need to hit .320.-330 just to reach the .340-.350 mark.
JI - February 19, 2009
I'm just a little bit concerned about his psyche, since he's hit so poorly when demoted to the bottom of the lineup
and after what happened in 2006 and 2007 it seems like he might be a little bit fragile. I’d really want Cedeno to prove something before I’d move into the 2-spot.
seattlebruin - February 19, 2009
Seattle is now a 72-win team!!
Congratulations Mariners’ fans, your team will be in contention until August 3rd instead of only being in contention until July 29th. This is a complete PR move. It’s not about money (Griff comes cheap), but why bother with this when all you’re doing is delaying the decision on whether Balentin is your LF of the future. You slow Balentin’s development (and possible alter it) to bring in a 40-year-old future HOF’er who can’t hit LHP anymore and who has lost significant power… Makes very little sense.
Uncle Charlie - February 19, 2009
Balentien isn't good and will still get plenty of ABs. The Mariners aren't a 72 win team on true talent.
This makes plenty of sense and is defensible as a baseball-only move.
Aaron Campeau - February 19, 2009
Balentien isn't good?
He’s 24 years old, and he has a grand total of 246 career MLB ABs. You’re willing to give up on him that easily? I’m not arguing that Balentien is a bonafide superstar, but he regressed for one season after being fairly decent the two seasons before. He may end up being a total chump, or he could be the next Richard Hidalgo, who wasn’t half-bad for a few seasons there. Doesn’t it make sense to find out what he is? Especially when you’re likely to finish the season under .500 and miss the playoffs anyway?
I admit, the answer could be no from a business perspective: Griff puts butts in the seats; the M’s are a losing team with Balentien or Griff; why not make more money?
But, from a baseball perspective, I don’t see any justification for this move. Griffey isn’t that good anymore.
Uncle Charlie - February 19, 2009
Balentien is still going to get ABs, though.
Griffey is the DH against RH pitchers. Balentien will get time at DH against LH pitchers and split time in LF with Chavez.
And it’s possible that Wlad develops into a good player, but I (and plenty of others) just don’t see it.
Aaron Campeau - February 19, 2009
Fair enough
It’s your opinion and the opinion of many others that Wlad won’t develop into a good player. I actually happen to agree with you, but… if I’m in the Mariners’ situation (where the playoffs are in the distant future), I’d rather just find out whether Wlad can become a good player, rather than relying on a crystal ball or scouting reports or sabermetrics or whatever.
Anyway, I’m beating a dead horse. I think you get what I’m saying, and I know I get what you’re saying…
Uncle Charlie - February 19, 2009
You're totally ignoring my larger point, which is that this signing is not really going to effect Wlad's playing time in any meaningful way.
And no one has given me a decent reason to believe that the Mariners can’t be legitimate playoff contenders in 2010.
Aaron Campeau - February 19, 2009
Or 2009 for that matter
JI - February 19, 2009
I guess I'm confused...
… how signing Griff doesn’t affect Wlad’s PT in any meaningful way. Is Griffey Jr. not going to play LF at all? If he’s not, then I suppose you are right, but… then the Griffey signing cuts into Clement’s PT, which is an even worse move for the Mariners. So, either you cut Wlad’s ABs or you cut Clement’s ABs. Neither seems smart.
As for a good reason to believe the M’s can’t compete in 2009 or 2010, I think you could just look at the PECOTA projections posted this morning… based on current rosters, PECOTA projects the AL West to finish as follows: Angels (84-78), A’s (82-80), Rangers (72-90), and Mariners (70-92). You may beg to differ with PECOTA’s projections, or you may hope that the Mariners can play way above their projected heads this season, but that’s at least a “decent reason to believe the Mariners can’t be legitimate playoff contenders” this season.
Uncle Charlie - February 19, 2009
I don't love PECOTA as a predictive tool for teams, and I said 2010.
Griffey probably isn’t going to play in the OF very much at all, and Clement will get the majority of his ABs at catcher.
Aaron Campeau - February 19, 2009
So the M's signed Johjima to a 3-year deal...
… to park him behind Clement as a backup. Or, are Clement and Kenji going to split time, in which case, why pay Johjima so much damn money?
Uncle Charlie - February 19, 2009
Because ownership mandated it and Bavasi was bad at his job.
Aaron Campeau - February 19, 2009
Gotcha
As a non-M’s fan, I have to remember that this is an organization built by two separate regimes. The Kenji contract is a holdover from the Bavasi Administration…
Uncle Charlie - February 20, 2009
PECOTA doesn't evaluate defense properly, or slot playing time properly.
…Team defense is one of the Mariners’ biggest assets.
it’s a useful tool for evaluating individuals (except for their defense), but I wouldn’t take any of their RA projections seriously.
JI - February 19, 2009
*Also a great question for the next PAQ thread would be
Why are BP’s defensive evaluations crap?
JI - February 19, 2009
OK...
So assuming the M’s aren’t 140 runs better than the Halos, and 120 runs better defensively than the A’s…
The A’s are pretty darn good defensively. The Angels might be a little behind the A’s, but not that much. Tough to argue that the M’s defense, which is admittedly good, is that much better than those two teams.
Uncle Charlie - February 19, 2009
The Mariners defense is so much better than the Angels it's not even funny.
Aaron Campeau - February 19, 2009
It is if you root for the Mariners
JI - February 19, 2009
The Angels outfield is a nightmare
JI - February 19, 2009
Yes, but...
… you could put eight fire hydrants out in the field and they wouldn’t be 140 runs worse than the M’s defense. You simply can’t make up that many runs on defense, no matter how bad the Angels D may be.
And… the A’s defense is right there with the M’s defense (A’s infield is probably better than the M’s; M’s outfield is probably better than the A’s), so you basically have no advantage there.
Uncle Charlie - February 20, 2009
Incidentally
the difference between the best and worst defensive teams last year by UZR was 141 runs.
Jeff Sullivan - February 20, 2009
Showoff
Sec 108 - February 20, 2009
No shit?
I stand corrected.
Uncle Charlie - February 20, 2009
Obviously those are the extremes
but defense matters an awful awful lot.
Jeff Sullivan - February 20, 2009
Cherry picker
JI - February 20, 2009
The Angels defense is tremendously bad.
Matthew - February 19, 2009
Who are they planning on starting?
When I went through the Marcels, their infield looked a bit above average, but most of those guys were utility players.
JI - February 19, 2009
Looks like Morales-Kendrick-Izturis-Figgins
Matthew - February 19, 2009
At second glance those four look slightly better than neutral
to go along with their clusterfuck of an outfield. (I know you can express that in a much more meaningful way)… in other words root for a lot of Abreu/Hunter/Vlad.
JI - February 19, 2009
He's Wily Mo Pena
JI - February 19, 2009
Richiard Hildalgo could play defense too
JI - February 19, 2009
Also...
… if you’re willing to spend $4.5 million on Griff, why not outbid the Nats on Adam Dunn or outbid the Angels on Abreu? It’s possible Dunn and Abreu didn’t want to play in the northwest, but you have to think that there was some price where it would have been impossible for those guys to turn down Seattle’s money. The fact that the M’s settled for Griff rather than spending on Abreu or Dunn suggests this was all about keeping fans happy… but keeping fan happy generally is not a good reason to make a baseball decision, especially one that involves slowing the development of two of your young players (Balentin and Clement). I like most of the moves that Seattle made this offseason, but this one is just dumb.
Uncle Charlie - February 19, 2009
It's not for $4.5 million.
There’s also the fact that ownership was willing to spend on Griffey and not other players.
Seriously, you’re making way too much of this.
Aaron Campeau - February 19, 2009
Dunn wasn't going to DH and we couldn't afford Abreu
Jeff Sullivan - February 19, 2009
If only we has 3 million more dollars...
JI - February 19, 2009
had
JI - February 19, 2009
We wanted Bradley but Bradley didn't want us
I think all parties would have been ecstatic about Bradley.
JI - February 19, 2009
This isn't a logical argument.
The Ms were under a severe budget constriction. If you refrain from making value judgments on moves before you attempt to find out all the relevant circumstances, you will come out far more ahead than when you make leaps of faith and then deride someone for not agreeing with you.
Matthew - February 19, 2009
Say what?
“If you refrain from making value judgments on moves before you attempt to find out all the relevant circumstances, you will come out far more ahead than when you make leaps of faith and then deride someone for not agreeing with you.” Uhh… what?
Uncle Charlie - February 20, 2009
He's saying don't jump to conclusions before you know all the information
Jeff Sullivan - February 20, 2009
You did not take the time to get all of the information.
Therefore your assertion about this move was wrong due to you being uninformed. In this case being uniformed was your fault and not the fault of someone else.
Did that help?
Sec 108 - February 20, 2009
Damnit! Lait.
Sec 108 - February 20, 2009
Thank you for your opinion; it shall be valued appropriately
Graham MacAree - February 19, 2009
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