Lookout Landing

Also from Baker is a great Griffey quote

"I’m filing a grievance,‘’ Griffey deadpanned. "I’m definitely filing a grievance. Two days in a row in the outfield, that’s the best I can do for a week.’’

So at least he’s self-aware enough to know his days are numbered in the field. His quotes are more straightforward than Ichiro’s but just as awesome.

Last week on the post-game show they were talking about how after he'd played in the outfield a couple games in a row

They had to drain like 8 oz. of fluid from his knee.

I can't help but feel

that if 1998 Griffey were on the verge of retirement, his quotes wouldn’t be as self-deprecating and he’d be angry and bitter. I like 2009 Griffey a lot better.

The good news is that I fully expect Branyan to go 5-5 with 5 HRs in New Yankee Stadium.

Ichiro will also hit a homerun.

joof - June 30, 2009 reply

Obligitory

It should also be noted that, if Langerhans is unavailable for some reason

Wlad/Griffey is still better than Griffey/Sweeney.

I wondered about that as well.

Langerhan might have jet lag or they wanted him to get use to the team.
I don’t know. I have never been traded.

mark sobba - June 30, 2009 reply

Langerhans is probably the only person in an M's uniform who didn't fly to NY.

He just played for Syracuse (NY) in AAA, and his last game was in Pawtucket. If jet lag’s a concern, they really should start him.

Bus lag?

He can take two seats on the Fung Wah bus so that should help a bit

Well then, I have nothing.

mark sobba - June 30, 2009 reply

I have a feeling Sweeney is in the lineup because his last good game bumped his line into quasi-not terrible territory.

Wak

subscribes to the old-school (A.K.A Lou Pinella) way of thinking: Play the veterans as long as possible. I like how he’s mostly handled the team this year but if I were a young batter, I would seriously hope that Wak was forced to play me (Carp during Branyan’s one day hiatus or Wlad’s OF adventures after Chavez got hurt).

He really, really doesn't.

Then why does he

seem to want to play Sweeney over Carp, even @ a DH role or play Griffey in LF to get Sweeney’s bat in the lineup? It makes no sense.

This is the first time he's played Griffey in an AL park in months.

This is a silly lineup and he's put out silly lineups in the past

but to say he’s anywhere close to the Piniella/Hargrove/McClaren school of veteran favoritism is silly.

Perhaps my comment comapring him to Lou was a bit 'quick'

But I still think Wak is loyal to the veterans or the ‘leaders’ in that clubhouse.

Well sure

but you’re drastically overstating your case.

Wak has tried to mix up his lineups all year trying to find something that works

some of them suck. This is one of them.

Hey if that's what you think I'd stick to your guns man, don't take any shit off these guys.

While he's not nearly as bad as them, there's a fair point to be made that he is showing some favoritism with Sweeney

From a talent perspective he shouldn’t even be on the team, and Wak is making room for him by taking at bats away from more productive but less veteran-ey players.

I have no problem with this statement

but hyperbole needs to be obviously in jest for one to expect to not be called out.

Rob Johnson, Shawn Kelley, Sean White, Vargas, Jakubaskus, and Wlad have all had significant playing time

I said "young batter" not young pitcher

which means I wasn’t referring to any of the pitchers, he obviously doesn’t have a veteran bias there. He’s ‘forced’ to play Wlad, not because he wants to.

How do you know this?

Mind meld

Kirsten Schlewitz - June 30, 2009 reply

I wouldn't play Wlad either unless I had no other options...that's how I 'know' it...

This logic is patently ridiculous.

But he joined just to bring his wisdom.

Kirsten Schlewitz - June 30, 2009 reply

So in other words you don't know and are just guessing.

It's just an observation on my part and perhaps It was silly.

But it at least would explain why the younger guys we want to see play then don’t get called up.

err..should say...

But at least it would explain why the younger players dont’ get much time after getting called up. It’s likely deeply flawed logic.

There is definitely some deeply flawed logic.

Wlad got quite a bit of playing time earlier in the year and he was hitting well for a couple weeks.

Carp will play more as the season goes on. Wak may not always have the best lineup construction but it’s not due to veteran loyalties. It’s who he truly thinks will win that day.

Hopefulmsfan - June 30, 2009 reply

Perhaps you're right there

I actually do like Wak and the direction the team is going in, it’s just frustrating to see players like Sweeney play at the expense of younger players, particularly ones we will have on this team next year instead of the ones we won’t.

Well, let's see what younger position players we've had on the roster this season.

Wlad: Discussed and we generally agree, although I like him better than you seem to.

Carp: 13 PA, got a start (maybe two? I can’t remember) and some PH opportunities. Blocked by Branyan at 1B and Griffey at DH vs. RHP. Griffey is a better hitter at this point (probably) and Carp isn’t going to take ABs away from him for any number of other reasons.

Johnson: Deserves to be in Tacoma (at best) but has spent a large part of the season as the starting catcher.

And…that’s about it, really. He can’t play Saunders if he hasn’t been called up, and if Carp isn’t better than Branyan or Griffey why would you play him?

Wak certainly favors veterans to some extent, but what manager doesn’t? And seeing as how this team is in a playoff race and the young players the team has at the MLB level aren’t necessarily an upgrade, how can you blame Wakamatsu?

You're right...

And if I had thought to think it out properly, I would’ve stated my opinion more. I don’t think Carp should start over Branyan but if Griffey is in LF to get more ‘bats’ in the lineup, Carp should be getting the call, at least in terms of matchups.

We agree on Johnson and while he calls a good game, he isn’t a starting catcher ever.

Again, I don’t hate Wak and certainly think he’s the best MGR the M’s have had since Lou, I just think his line-ups are flawed at times…

No disagreement re: today's lineup.

Carp should be starting vs. a righty, especially considering the venue.

this was the main basis of my arguement

And should’ve been the beginning and ending of my thought. I am generally not some lunatic thoughtless ‘commenter.’ If I were, I would’ve left that at the Seattle Times pages…

We could've had five lefties in the lineup today: Carp (1B), Griffey (DH), Branyan (3B), Ichiro (RF) and Langerhans (LF)

I don’t like Branyan at third for a month, but a game or two will most likely be fine. Cedeno’s playing mad SS too.

five lefties in the lineup would have been awesome

damn the infield defense. I wanna see five M’s go yard.

PattyB - June 30, 2009 reply

The younger player who might be able to help the team (and there's really only one)

hasn’t been called up mainly because he sucks.

Huh? Saunders?

I’m missing something, possibly sarcasm.

Nate Dogg - June 30, 2009 reply

Clement and it is Graham bait.

Well thats silly

Clement’s never going to help this team.

Nate Dogg - June 30, 2009 reply

Not while Sweeney is here!

I don't really want Saunders called up, actually

I trust in GMZ, and if the FO thinks he needs a bit more development time in AAA, I’m completely OK with that.

Plus that whole strained hammie thing.

I don't follow.

Woodward and Cedeno both in the lineup too, yay

Here's how I see it.

Wak figures that there’s no way Morrow beats the Yankees anyway, so he throws token playing time to Sweeney in a game that won’t matter.

Llewdor - June 30, 2009 reply

Yeah that makes sense.

Imagine if I need to match up five guys to fight five guys you have.

Further imagine that each group can be neatly ranked 1-5.

Now, if I get some sort of prize for winning the majority of the matches, I suggest that the best matchups for me involve my two weakest guys fighting your two strongest guys. Sure, I’ll lose those fights, but that grants me an advantage in the other three fights.

Sorry about the fighting analogy. I just came from BloodyElbow.com.

Ideally, Wak would never choose this lineup, but if he’s going to then doing it in a game where we were already likely to fail is arguably a good idea.

Llewdor - June 30, 2009 reply

Kind of like the 1-hit performance last year against the Yanks

With a weaker defense behind him no less.

TrashiDawa - June 30, 2009 reply

Definitely repeatable.

Surrendering before playing the game seems like a good strategy

If that's the case then why play Ichiro, Gutierrez, or Branyan at all?

Rest em so they don’t get hurt Wak, we’ve already lost this game.

Hopefulmsfan - June 30, 2009 reply

Sweeney will be playing against the two lefties on Wednesday and Thursday. No need

to throw him a bone

In his blog, Baker posted:

RF Ichiro
1B Russell Branyan
2B Jose Lopez
LF Ken Griffey Jr.
DH Mike Sweeney
CF Franklin Gutierrez
3B Chris Woodward
C Kenji Johjima
SS Ronny Cedeno

RHP Brandon Morrow

Should read: RIP Brandon Morrow

Even in spite of this disappointing news..

I’m still excited for this game

Fearless Frog - June 30, 2009 reply

Griffey is going to wind up on the DL at this rate.

Jackpot

I wouldn't mind that.

gregrabble - June 30, 2009 reply

I was thinking the same thing.

PascoJoe - June 30, 2009 reply

I think Zduriencik

has instructed Wak to play Griffey in the field until his knee explodes and he goes on the DL so they don’t have to pay him as much.

I Lick Squirrels - June 30, 2009 reply

Then again you lick squirrels

Licking squirrels has been scientifically proven to increase mental capacity.

And I don’t think the team management just forgot that last time Griffey played LF 3 games in a row, he had to have an abortion’s worth of blood drained from his knee.

I Lick Squirrels - June 30, 2009 reply

Whoa, there.

No politics dude

They shouldna done that he's just a boy

Slingblade?

Poor little feller

Had to make sure, I can't help but rec Slingblade references.

Technically it's Eric Cartman doing Slingblade

Can't rec it twice, sorry dude.

*[COATHANGER]'s worth of blood

Dewey N - June 30, 2009 reply

Hmm

joof - June 30, 2009 reply

Ah, I see [COATHANGER] is back.

We missed you, old meme.

No we didn't

Maybe you didn't.

How can you miss it if it doesn't go away?

http://www.lookoutlanding.com/search?btn=Go&order=date&q=coathanger&type=Comment

It never went away? 4 times this year is a lot I suppose.

I guess I just don’t see any harm in taking the overused ones and recycling them every once in a while.

That being said, I don't really have an attachment to it.

I just don’t find the whining productive. If you ignore it, it’ll only show up every once in a while.

I think you're taking me a wee bit too seriously

And I’m a Serial Dead Meme Offender.

Who's whining?

The person who invented coathanger was banned.

Not so much for that reason.

Might have been

Robert - June 30, 2009 reply

If I remember correctly

Jeff said whoever used it would get banned.

Robert - June 30, 2009 reply

I'd like to see the new guy play too but...

I have to say that going into this brutal 9-game road trip, it was smelling like each of the last 5+ seasons “hey, we’re in this!” 11-game (or more) rally-killing skid that we always seem to hit. So after the series win in LA, I have faith in Wak that I did not have in past regimes.

Azimeir - June 30, 2009 reply

I'd have more faith in him if he put the most efficient lineup on the field today

I can't believe the Nationals ripped someone off that badly

I guess it is the Pirates, though.

It wasn't exactly a fleecing.

How so?

Nyjer Morgan is loads better than Lastings Milledge. Joel Hanrahan is useless, and the other pitcher the Pirates threw in is pretty insignificant.

Morgan is 29 and has limited upside beyond what he currently is, and Sean Burnett may or may not suck.

Hanrahan isn’t totally useless and Milledge is 24 and was a top prospect not so long ago. Ignoring whether or not Milledge pans out, they gain upside with risk in exchange for a lower ceiling sure thing.

Joel Hanrahan is an above league average reliever and plus the Nats already had Nyjer Morgan in Ryan Langerhans

Graham MacAree - June 30, 2009 reply

And now they have Mike Morse!

Just noticed Hanrahan's BABIP and LOB%

Holy crap has he been unlucky this year. So I will concede that. And maybe I’m just not a fan of Lastings Milledge, given his terrible defense, and offense that hasn’t shown much sign of coming around.

Ryan Langerhans was a completely different trade. We’re agreed that the Nationals were stupid in that regard.

Evaluating a trade that happened yesterday completely seperately from one that happened today doesn't seem right

Graham MacAree - June 30, 2009 reply

I didn't say in my first post

“The Nationals are smart” or “the Nationals make good decisions.” I said “Wow, the Nationals actually made a good trade, today”

That implied that I even recognize that the Nationals make bad trades, including the one yesterday.

If we’re analyzing the Nationals’ decision making in general, then yes, it was stupid to give up Hanrahan and Milledge for a guy that essentially gives the same production as the guy they just gave up for nothing. Of course.

But we need to evaluate this from Pittsburgh's standpoint too.

I get trading from depth and all that, but they seem to have traded Nate McLouth and Nyjer Morgan (collectively worth around 3 wins+ so far at the time of trade) for the black Jeremy Reed, an Ezequiel Carrera clone and some pitching prospects. Oh, and a reliever who’s worth a half run above average or so.

Yes, the Nats motive here is tough to see (I totally get the Morgan trade in isolation), but I really, really don’t know what’s going on with Huntington.

Milledge has already had way more success than Jeremy Reed and is much younger.

Jeremy Reed WAR through his age 24 season: 2.6

Lastings Milledge career WAR: -0.3.

Jeremy Reed could defend for a while there.

I meant as a hitter

Irrelevant.

If it's a change of scenery trade, I'm pretty sure they're hoping for MIlledge to break out as a hittter

which he has shown flashed of

If he were to do so that would compensate for his bad defense. A good glove can only make you so valuable if you are a flat out impotent hitter like Reed was. They’re definitely trading for his ceiling and giving up Morgan doesn’t seem like a huge price to play.

Don’t get me wrong, I think they could have found a better target, but I don’t see how Milledge is in any way comparable to Reed.

Both were hyped prospects but not useful MLB players.

For Milledge to accumulate enough playing time to add some value offensively (which would be a significant improvement), he’d have to play in the field. It seems likely, given his track record, that his defensive play would counter his offensive contributions.

Again, as impotent as Reed was, he actually gave the M’s 2.6 WAR before his head melted. Milledge has yet to show anything close to that. A terrible glove means your hitting can make you only so valuable.

And the whole point of these trades was to make their outfield defense better

Instead they’ve made a ~lateral move defensively which cost them a 24 year old CFer who at one time was a projected all star (and could still be, who knows?) and an above average reliever.

Oh, and they got Mike Morse.

They got one of the best defensive OFs in the game

in exchange for a putrid defender, who also gave you below average offense and major attitude problems.
Yes, yes, former top prospect, toolsy. But there’s no way to see Milledge and Morgan as equivalents. Sure, Morgan may never improve, and will likely decline. He can fall a looooong way to get close to Milledge’s value.

Hanrahan is better than Burnett, though.

And relievers just aren't that useful

If Lastings Milledge pans out, I’ll gladly eat crow. But he’s going to have to be damn good on offense to replace Morgan.

You know, seeing you tag I just remembered about that game

and you know what? it looks like rain here in NYC.

Yup, thunderstorms where I am just outside the city

exactly.

put Carp in @ DH if you want to maximize a matchup.

Mike Sweeney is 7 for his last 11.

While I think Wak and company are very open to the different offensive and defensive metrics.. I still think there is a bit of old school in the guy that tells him that Sweeney is swinging a good bat lately and is on a hot streak.

We'd be in trouble if Wak believed in 7 for 11.

I just don't think he's at the point yet where he's just going to go by numbers.

I still think he has a part of him that believes in the veteran leadership, hot streaks, etc.

So he's like Terminator staring at John Conner? His vision flashes "wOBA!" then cancels and selects "Leader" repeatedly?

Not familiar with that reference, but sounds about right.

Fun fact!

Princess Willie is a better player than Mike Sweeney at this point in their respective careers, and arguably a comparable hitter.

It sort of blows my mind that as a team we could actually use WFB everyday and improve the team (basically, put him at 2B and Loafie at 3B), but there you go.

Sweeney would have started FAR more games than he had been if Wak played players based on leadership.

ThundaPC - June 30, 2009 reply

Didn't say that is his #1 priority. Just that on occasion we'll see moves like this one

or Junior in LF with a flyball pitcher, or Junior starting vs a lefty. Wak gets it right most of the time, but I think on occasions he’ll throw a bone to some of the leaders/vets on this team

I imagine this is what it is

Sweeney’s hitting .385 for the month, and Wak hasn’t read enough of The Book to know that that doesn’t matter.

The commercials say he likes to read..

Can we gift-wrap him a copy of The Book?

d0nkey - June 30, 2009 reply

Sweeney doesn't play very much.

The obvious motive is to get him more playing time. My only concern is why today as opposed to the next two games with lefties on the mound?

ThundaPC - June 30, 2009 reply

Langerhans is with the team

per Baker.

Good news!

We might not have to deal with this lineup today!

According to Baker it’s pouring in New York and the game is in doubt.

Well this sucks, I've been amped for start time all day.

I think they'll play. The update forcast has the storms passing around 8

east coast time that is

It'll probably pass.

I just cleared it about an hour ago, took about an hour to go over.

Don't count on it

My guess iis it’ll clear by eight so Griffey will just be playing on wet grass

Torn ACL here we go!

He can get a wheelchair from every city during his retirement tour instead of a rocking chair

serotonein - June 30, 2009 reply

Brock and Salk just raised the thought ....

if they won 7 out of 10 championships, would Mariner fans become as obnoxious as Yankee fans?

I'd give anything to find out

and speaking for myself, I can say I’d love to think not but probably.

I would, yes

In a Seattle Passive-Agressive sort of way, I'd think...

PositivePaul - June 30, 2009 reply

There would be nothing passive about it for me

I think the correct comparison

Is after about 85 years of FAIL, winning a couple of championships, a la Red Sox Nation.

Yeah, that seems more Seattle.

I'll say that I'm pretty sure we wouldn't match them.

That being said, fuck the Yankees.

Yeah the Red Sox don't even play here and look what happened with that

Absolutely

Probably, but with less cursing.

I love a good New York rant.

Jed MC - June 30, 2009 reply

I'd be obnoxious but there's no way to be more so than the Yankee fans. Too much history they can reference

Yes, no question.

Who will be our Jeter?

I think Mariner fans would become obnoxious but in a much less horrible manner than Yankee fans.

In happier news from Baker

“Adrian Beltre underwent successful surgery today in California, where bone spurs were removed from his left shoulder. There was no additional damage to the rotator cuff, though the bursa sack was inflamed. That inflammation should subside now that the spurs are gone. Wakamatsu said this could lead to an accelerated return to action for Beltre.

“We’re hoping,‘’ he said. "We’re still looking six to eight weeks, but maybe, if everything goes well, we can bring him up here a little bit quicker than that.’’"

So the Carlos Silva treatment has been 100% hilarious

By hilarious I assume you mean delightful.

Is he even still alive?

the what? huh?

I still want to know what treatment ...

on YES, or something?

Just the fact that he's disappeared completely

FSN featured him heavily on their Father's Day show.

along with Randy Messenger.

It was inspirational.

Carlos Silva being forgotten about is quite inspirational for me.

I see they’re going for the full Cirillo, complete with an advanced case of suckitis.

Who?

Out for the year?

We had a Carlos Silva?

Slurvey - June 30, 2009 reply

I thought you were refusing to acknowledge his existence?

Or was that Matthew?

This front office is sure making it easy to not acknowledge his existence

Because it doesn't seem like they do either

Who?

That name sounds familiar- wasn’t he on the team last year or something?

Buffet-linked selective amnesia

It’s spreading from Minneapolis…

Selective amnesia might also explain some elements of pitch selection for this team.

Who?

Kirsten Schlewitz - June 30, 2009 reply

Carlos whova?

Anyone watching Yankees BP on the YES network? Wonder if they'll show

Branyan taking some shots at RF

Oh, lordy.

“Coming up next, the Captain, Derek Jeter sits down with Rick Rizzs.”

I can't believe they gave that guy his own ship.

Yep.

A ship with a LOT of lovely shipmates.

He's still better than Bakula

Is this boat real?

In case you haven't picked it up from Baker

we could have Bedard and Kelley back by Saturday.

I thought Bedard was gone until two setbacks from now.

8====>

8======>

))<>((

Lay off the cheeseburgers lady

That's not what that is at all.

Back and forth

Forever

tootthekazoo - June 30, 2009 reply

If you plan to one up him, at least do it properly.

())||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||D

())||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||D (SBN Formatting removes the underscores in the body of comments, apparently.)

I think you mean ()()<========8

You appear to be suffering from the same problem that Felix Pie faced a few years ago.

Trapped behind Jim Edmonds?

Testicular torsion

Alert Scrappy, I hear he's hungry for some labrum.

Excellent. Is Olson going to be the odd man out or will it be Morrow?

Olsen

Olson

>:(

Wrong odd man out.

He's been crap so far out of the rotation,

so…. whatever.

Morrow existentially annoys me more than Olson does.

But OK, yeah, it’s probably pick ’em at this point.

It's my Norwegian heritage.

hvordan staar det til?

I am about one month away from understanding this whole sentence.

Nice! Why?

Trying to learn Danish.

So maybe not 100%, but should be able to grasp that gist.

I gather they read similarly, but that the pronunciaton varies greatly

That's putting it mildly.

I thought I’d be able to get by in Denmark with no trouble. It sounded like everyone’s voice had been put through some weird flange effect.
The old adage that it’s norwegian spoken through a mouthful of potato is true, but somehow still not strong enough.

Yeah, have fun with that.

Written, you should have no trouble. Spoken, that language is fucked up.

I've heard it's akin to English. Just compare

NW English to Bayou English to Wales English

Worse, imo.

Welsh english (even much of northern England) contains different words, and that can sometimes throw you. A welsh accent, as opposed to just plain Welsh, isn’t THAT bad.

But hey, see what you think. I’d imagine it’s easier to go from learning Danish —> Norsk than the other way around, but it may still cause some confusion.

Skål for helsen!

Aw crap, you went all out with the special characters and everything.

Takk skal du ha, by the way.

I actually know virtually no Norewegian

my grandfather was very much of the ’I’m American’ school

I'm not norwegian at all.

I just learned the world’s most useless language.

I seriously think Esperanto might have more speakers than good ol’ Norsk.

Finnish is far more useless.

At least w/Norwegian you basically get Danish and Swedish for free.

Good point. Though Finland has more people than Norway,

you get Estonia for free, and there’s Nokia.

Move to Ballard

Norwegian Constitution Day was a fun way to drink away an afternoon

serotonein - June 30, 2009 reply

Looking at the forecasts for New York...

this entire series could be rained out. That would be nice.

I'd really like to have to fly back to New York three times on off days.

And some late-season double-headers!

Except for having to make up dates in September

By then we'll be out of the race and I won't care

But if we're still in the race it'll be mighty annoying

No kidding.

We can have our rotation and bullpen trashed AND get screwed-up road trips!

While I don't put a ton of stock in the idea of momentum

I think there’s something to be said for playing this series in the context of this road trip.

The bottom line is that it's better to play them now than it is to make them up later

Maybe this means nothing and maybe it means everything

But on the team site, Langerhans is on the 40-man but not the active roster. Could there be a transaction hiccup that won’t let us use him till tomorrow?

calim - June 30, 2009 reply

They need to clear a spot for him on the 25 man but have not done so yet.

He's active, Beltre's on the DL

shows what I know.

It's easy to miss

If I were only more detail-oriented I would have remembered to wear pants to work.

So long as you are wearing your jersey....