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Hisashi Iwakuma: Player Of Interest

You might remember that, last offseason, the Oakland A's won the rights to negotiate with posted Japanese starter Hisashi Iwakuma. It was a surprising announcement on account of Oakland A's, but they submitted the high bid of $19.1 million. In the end they did not end up spending that $19.1 million, as the A's and Iwakuma failed to reach an agreement. Some people thought the A's cheated, blocking Iwakuma from competitors with a high bid despite having no intention of signing him. Other people did not think this. There were a variety of opinions, by which I mean there were at least two opinions.

You might not remember that, last offseason, after the A's were revealed as the winners, reports emerged that the Mariners didn't make a bid. There had been talk that the Mariners were heavily interested in Iwakuma, but then there was talk that the Mariners weren't really interested at all. Quote:

But the Mariners "did not bid on this guy,'' one source said. "They didn't participate.''
...
The Mariners scouted him, then decided to pass.

"It was a baseball decision,'' the source said. "It didn't have anything to do with the ownership group.''

Now, we don't know if that's true or false. The posting process is a weird one, and it can be difficult to uncover the truth. But here's what we know now: Iwakuma's a free agent. He's 30 years old. And the Mariners are supposedly hot in pursuit.

According to Jon Heyman, the M's are gunning for Iwakuma, along with two other AL teams. According to Nikkan Sports, the M's could be close to signing Iwakuma. Those say two different things, although now that I think about it, they really don't. "Could" is such a powerful word, for a not powerful word.

It passes the smell test. The Mariners have been in search of a veteran starter, and Iwakuma is a veteran starter, albeit a veteran somewhere else. I don't know if the Mariners are considering Iwakuma instead of other options or Iwakuma along with other options, but nothing about this is outlandish. We just don't know the depth of the Mariners' interest, or the level of Iwakuma's demands. Desires? Desires is probably better. Iwakuma is in no position to make demands.

So what is a Hisashi Iwakuma? Again, he's 30. Japanese. Right-handed. He throws a fastball in the 87-91mph range, seemingly having lost some velocity to shoulder issues. He throws that ever-popular shuuto, which is a lot like a two-seamer. He has a splitter, and a slider, and a curve, and when all of his pitches are working he's flat-out dominant, as is the case with every pitcher everywhere. You're free to analyze his pitches on YouTube, although you should remember that most of that footage is highlights, and highlights deceive. No player is ever as good as he looks in his highlights.

Statistically, Iwakuma shines as a control specialist, having walked just 1.7 batters per nine innings over the last four years. He hasn't missed that many bats, putting up a roughly league-average strikeout rate, but he's excelled by avoiding walks and avoiding home runs. Over that same four-year span, his ERA is 2.58. Last year he was about as effective as D.J. Houlton, which is a good thing in Japan.

The concerns are that Iwakuma's shoulder might be in less-than-great shape, and that he might have trouble recording strikeouts against Major League hitters. There is also the possibility that his shoulder is fine, and that he could make the transition with ease. For all of the words people have written about Japanese players coming to the States, nobody has been able to reliably identify who'll be good and who'll be bad. Iwakuma could be good, or bad, or somewhere in between.

So we see. It all depends on the price, right? It's not like Jeff Francis, Jamie Moyer and Kevin Millwood are guaranteed to be successful, either. And Iwakuma has that upside that the others don't. Who's to say he doesn't adjust as well as Koji Uehara adjusted? Francis could be a #4 or a #3. Iwakuma could be a #4 or a #3 or a #2. To explain this unscientifically.

If Iwakuma checks out physically, he's a very interesting option. We'll see where this one goes. With the Mariners being in their current position, there's something to be said for an unknown over a Francis or a Millwood. Francis and Millwood are known. So very known. Iwakuma has that volatility you hate as a contender but love as a longshot.

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Comments

We should sign a Japanese guy who hits dingers
Dingers!
Hideki Matsui?
Prince Fielder-san
Tuffy Rhodes, called out from retirement.

Smaller picture and subject line required.
Pic is for Fielder-san

Was a re: to lemonvervena’s subject tag

What he's saying is that the picture needs to be smaller

and it needs to include a subject line so the picture can be collapsed if need be.

I was pointing out the site rules.
thx
Chatspeak's a no no as well
If the picture was smaller would Prince fit?

Rim shot

I apologize in advance.

Low hanging fruit, etc.

I bet Ichiro could hit like 30 a year if he wanted to
I know you're making a funny

but now I can’t put .280/.340/.520 Ichiro out of my mind.

I always imagined when Ichiro started hitting for power,

his average would skyrocket for unexplainable reasons and he would also break his own hits record.

You ever seen him take BP

I watch him in Arlington, which is a hitters ballpark, and he always hits for power. Of course it is just bp but I think he can do it.

For the eleventy billionth time

if he could do it, he already would be doing it. Do you have any idea how hard it is to learn to hit at the major league level one way, much less learn to hit two completely different ways and keep one on the shelf just in case?

What does that have to do with my comment?

Of course if he could do it already he would be doing it, Captain state the obvious. I’m talking about batting practice. I see him hit for power in bp all the time when he comes to Arlington. Of course that is not a measuring stick, it’s only against right down the middle slow pitches.

And no, I have no idea how hard it is, but I can imagine. I’m sure unless you play major league baseball you have no idea either. I was not being serious dude, calm down.

Sarcasm is hard to do online.

I (and probably several others) thought your comment was serious. If your joking flies over someone’s head don’t take offense. If your comment was read as serious, then pdb’s response was reasonable.

This is true

Thanks man. I understand…..

If you were not serious then I misread your comment and I apologize

it’s just that the “Ichiro can hit 40 HR if he wants to” thing is really tired and has no basis in reality and is said often enough that it is a bit of a sore point.

I don't see why people limit him to just 40 HRs. Easily a 50/50 club guy.
I'm not sure he could bang out 50 triples...
That's right.

You just keep shooting for that floor that doesn’t exist.

Focking minimalist.

Ok my bad

No I was joking. Been a M’s fan my whole life, although I’m only 29 I’ve seen most of Ichiro’s career. I was just commenting on his batting practice. Dude hits it out of the park with consistency. It’s funny to see. I didn’t take offense, I was just being defensive. My bad guys…..

I've always wondered if management talks to Ichiro about these guys he played with during the WBC.

I mean, I know players don’t usually get a lot of input on these things, and it should ultimately be a baseball decision, but with guys coming over from Japan, I’ve always wondered if the front office would care if Ichiro told them a particular player was a total douche.

I would wonder what Ichiro even knows about Japanese league players anymore, considering it's been a decade since he played there.
Yeah, but he still played with most of the ones who come over on the WBC team.
Yeah, but isn't it true that teams that rely on the opinion of a guy who played a few games with a dude, are teams that make bad decisions?
I'm not saying the M's do or should rely on his opinion, I've just always wondered if they talk to him about it.
In riddles Ichiro speaks

Jack Z: “So this Hisashi Iwakuma — is he any good? Would he make a good Mariner?”

Ichiro: “His pitching is like the early morning sun on the cherry blossoms on the shores of Lake Kawaguchiko. And in the club house he is like the finest wasabi, quiet on the edge of your plate until the otoro calls out for it.”

If he doesn't walk people but doesn't miss many bats.

Sounds like he’s one of those induce weak contact types. I wonder if those guys are more likely to make the transition from Japan to MLB as opposed to one who relies on swing and miss stuff.
Although I guess it stands to reason if the swing and miss stuff wont fool MLB hitters, then they may well be able to make better contact on the other stuff.
I know nothing!

Hiroki Kuroda says hi...

though admittedly I liked him a lot more because he carried a small ERA despite playing in the bandbox formerly known as Old Hiroshima Municipal. Personally, I think he gets overlooked because he doesn’t blow by batters, just exhibits good control.

Is Iwakuma another Kuroda? That I don’t know.

"induce weak contact types"

um…

I knew someone would reference Mac Suzuki eventually.
I have no idea what you're getting at.
"induce[s] weak contact" reads to me like "keeps a low BABIP"
Don't we give some credit to pitchers over their ability to control that?
Like a eensy teensy really tiny amount that you can't pick up on until like 10 years in
Ahh, okay.

Good to know, cheers.

I thought one of the upsides to Francis/Moyer/Millwood

Was that he could easily be traded (to a desirous contender) if not outright cut should Hultzen or Paxton (probably not Walker) appear ML-ready sometime later this season. Would that instead involve demoting Beavan?

Trade Vargas.
Vargas has been a steady starter

I’d hate to trade him unless we get something good in return.

Yeah! Get something good.
Drop off from Vargas to Beavan shouldn't be too much, plus salary relief, plus maybe something interesting coming back.
I'm tired of salary relief

I want something in return. I forgot about Beaven, he did well but Vargas has been very consistent for the past two seasons. I’d hate to get Doug Fisted again.

Why would you trade a first time arb-eligible league average starter without something interesting coming back?
Maybe I'm not understanding you, but Vargas has his 2nd arb year this off season.

And in this scenario, with Vargas getting traded during the season, he would be going into his 3rd arb year.

Normally I'd rather have the devil I know

But it’s Kevin Millwood, so bring on the shuuto-flinging Japanese guy.

I'll take Moyer

I like that he is almost a hundred.d

I don't. That's all any sportswriter would ever mention,ever.
If that's the case then sign him! Then they can't talk about us needing a big bat in the lineup
Only 30 years, old? Add 19 more then lets talk!
Mariner's Off-Season in a nutshell:

Source: “Mariners are interested in interesting player.”
Mariners: “We are interested in any player it makes sense for us to be interested in, to the extent that we are interested in the interesting player.”
Crickets: “Chirp. Chirp.”

And?
Exactly.
Should it be any different?
Of course it should, it's not like there's 5+ weeks left until spring training or something

Any team who hasn’t made a move by now is a LOO-SER.

Because made up news is better earlier or later in the off-season?

I don’t think anyone was making the argument that the M’s need to make a move for the sake of making a move.

Possibly.

There could be a lot less “rosterbation” every off-season.
I’m not fond of the idea that just because there isn’t any news, that anything can be made into news.

Iwakuma may be a poor example, as there is probably something to this report, but what percentage of reports do eventually pan out? Something like less than 10%? That might be generous.

Certainly it’s pointless to expect anything to change, but I think I’ve more than earned my right to be jaded about the process.

Sounds a lot like that Doug Fister guy.
Fister throws harder, doesn't he?
Nope. Same range.
Fister started hitting 94 last year.
Then I'm wrong.

I was just going by FanGraphs’ data.

Gahhh

That start he had against the Indians right after joining the Tigers was just sick. 13 ks I believe, darting 93mph 2-seamers on the corners. He’s got some Felix in him, and I’d rather have him than Pineda, to be honest.

IGNORE ME, THIS IS NOT ROSTERBATION BUT I AM GOING NOWHERE

No I'd rather have him than Pineda

Pineda would have returned more and holy shit Doug Fister is magic

I still don't know why we traded Doug Fister
We were not a good team

and so we thought we could get players to make us a better team in the future for a player that could be replaced in the future by players in our system.

If Casper Wells never has vertigo again it might look okay in time.

Because the Ms have some starting pitchers looming on the horizon or something.

But no beard

Beard Fister was awesome

The crickets from Adam B's post sound like Doug Fister.
He'd need a different color glove,

do they come in ‘NW Green’?

Just nail it to the north side of a tree
Sponichi report

Here essentially seems to say we are the frontrunner. Google translation of a quote from Iwakuma:

“Negotiations have begun to be opened in the year moves. Baseball team has received several conditions presented there, given the environment and family life to someone for their own needs, the contract at this stage Mariners The closest team "

A better translation from MLBTR that corroborates that (for what its worth):
We’ve received terms from a number of clubs, but considering where I’m needed and an environment my family can live in, at present we’re closest to a contract with the Mariners," Iwakuma said.
"We've exchanged phone calls" - Jack Zduriencik
That's quote is only a joke, it's my version of what he always says

Just in case someone thought I was being serious

We've always done well with Japanese players

Good track record. I can’t think of any failures. Everyone we’ve brought over has performed to or above expectations.

Mac Suzuki kinda sucked.
But he also didn't cost anything.
What about Hasegawa?
We didn't bring him over.
His name was Dave Niehaus's favorite to pronounce, therefore he was worth it.

Anything that made Dave happy was worth it.

Hasegawa was pretty darn respectable for a couple of years.

And I’ll take pretty darn respectable over Norihiro Nakamura or Kei Igawa style flameouts.

Since he was a failed posting last year is there a chance we're getting a bargain of sorts here?

Also, what’s a likely ceiling? Solid #3?

He seems to be a pretty big groundball guy (splitter and shuuto) with good control, but still gets a decent number of K's

I’ve seen 2010 Doug Fister and peak Chien-Ming Wang as comps, and both seem somewhat valid. Given his stats in Japan, I’d guess his ceiling might end up falling somewhere in between those two comps (slightly more GB than Fister, but a worse K/BB) for maybe 3-3.5 WAR.

Probably something similar to Hiroki Kuroda, ideally
It sounds like that's what he was asking for last year.

http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/12/08/agent-angry-at-as-over-failed-hisashi-iwakuma-negotiations/

He might actually be trying for more this year, considering he has the rights to negotiate with all teams, and whomever signs him doesn’t have to pay the additional $19 million posting fee. If I were his agent, I would be assuming that waiting the year would at least be significantly better than the offer he got from the A’s.

Not having done any research,

do we know exactly what the A’s tendered as an offer? Also, do we know what the ultimate reason(s) for him not signing is/ were?

Sorry. Missed the link.

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